BOOKMAKERS WHO GAMBLE

Although this will appear on Home Page later today, I thought I'd present it here for some discussion. Here's my opinion...

Is this right, wrong, or does it really matter?

If you are a bookmaker who gambles, then shame on you! I believe it is WRONG to be engaged in both activities at the same time.

I have been giving this topic a lot of thought lately, because SOME of the offshore sports book operators I know actually GAMBLE on ballgames for themselves.

Either be a bookmaker or a player, but please DON'T play both sides of the fence.

An analogy that comes to mind is a drug dealer. What does one think about someone who not only sells illicit drugs to others, but who also uses these same drugs for himself? How long will he stay in business?

If you are a bookmaker, then be a bookmaker. With profits being so thin these days due to the tremendous competition and multiple perks that are being offered, the bookmaker who also gamblers will EVENTUALLY do more harm than good to himself and his customers.

To be a successful bookmaker is a FULL TIME job. To compete in today's market takes not only a good linesman, but a good advertising team as well.

To be an accomplished PLAYER is also a FULL TIME job which is very burdensome. It requires dedication, discipline, and a firm understanding about numbers and value.

There is simply not enough hours in the day for someone to be successful at bookmaking and gambling. I do not know of ANYONE who consistently WINS as a Bookmaker and a Player.

Here's a scarey thought.

What if the person who is bookmaking and betting himself should run into a LOSING streak in BOTH arenas?

The odds of going BROKE clearly DOUBLE because of this.

Everyone knows that bankrolls are extremely volatile for a Bookmaker and a Player.

However, what happens when the bookmaker who is gambling finds himself betting on the same side of a ballgame that his customers are also on?

Or, what if the bookmaker is betting on ballgames that are opposite his customers?

Do you see how confusing this all becomes?

Imagine how the bookmaker who gambles must feel like. Who should he root for?

He cannot WIN when gamblers are betting the SAME games into him that he, himself bets on!

There are bookmakers who have gone broke without wearing two hats. There are MORE bookmakers who have gone broke when they book and gamble concurrently.

Personally, I truly believe that the majority of bookmakers that gamble have a GAMBLING PROBLEM. Since the odds are clearly in favor of the person who BOOKS the bet, then it is only a matter of time before an offshore bookmaker who gambles will lose all of his profits, period.

With the evolution of the offshore gambling industry becoming more like Fortune 500 companies, it is WRONG for a successful sports book to be betting on ballgames.

In conclusion, let's look closely at WHO many would consider to be the CREME of the crop in the offshore gaming sector today.

OLYMPIC SPORTS, WORLD SPORTS EXCHANGE, WWTS, CRIS, CARIBE, and BETONSPORTS are amongst the offshore leaders in this industry. Almost everyone I know would list these sports books at the top.

Guess how many of these successful sports books gamble on ballgames themselves?

The answer is ZERO.

NADA!

That, in itself, should speak VOLUMES about the position I take.

Regards,

THE SHRINK




[This message has been edited by THE SHRINK (edited 09-12-2000).]

[1001]

are you sure spiro doesnt bet because i hear different.

[Spearmaster]

For the most part I agree - this is good common sense. But it is also unfair to force a bookmaker to not gamble, as that should be his right and choice.

To put it bluntly, you can't stop the bookmaker, but I am not so certain I would be placing my money with a bookie who also bets.

[Mr Costa Rica]

Hey Shrink,

I think you might be surpised at the number of BM that gamble. This is not at all uncommon. But I beleive where they get caught is when they also reflect thier opinion in their line, then they lose twice. I agree with you this is not good practice, but hey, the BM for the most part is the biggest gambler out there....

[SquareSucker]

I put the following under a new topic heading, not realzing a thread had already been started.

Here's what I wrote (except for the part where the name of NASA's owner, who goes by the alias Greg Champion, is inexplicably blacked out.) How come moderators on this site address some posters by their proper names but "protect" the identity of (advertising) bookies?. . .

"Either be a bookmaker or a player, but please DON'T play both sides of the fence." -- The Shrink
I laughed heartily at this latest gem from the Master of Fence-Splitting.

True, bookies shouldn't gamble -- it's bad business and probably unethical. Sort of like being a paid shill for those you are supposedly judging.

Here's a guy, Ken Weitzner, whose persona is that of an advocate, a "watchdog" for the burgeoning off-shore gambling industry. Yet, as everyone knows, he accepts money from those he's allegedly watching over, going so far as to include crooks like **** ****** (NASA) on The Prescription's increasingly worthless "reputable" list.

Anyone who agrees with The Shrink's noble declaration "Either be a bookmaker or a player, but please DON'T play both sides of the fence" would probably agree with this plea, too: "Either be a player's advocate or a tool of the sportsbooks, but please DON'T play both sides of the fence."

Let the equivocations begin!

[bookyman]

Shrink, good post

Square Sucker,
Just because you don't agree with the Shrink's business practices doesn't invalidate his opinion. He can run his site like he wants, and I for one value his opinion because he has proved himself to be knowlegdable about this business. If you don't like it, don't come here.

[razor]

I totally disagree,book or bet if I'm sharper than you i'll get your money every time.I've personally bet for over fifteen years and never been close to having a losing year, months many but never a year.By booking you obviously get the better of it but look where you have to live.If you have a good opinion use it or if you know people who have good opinions use them.This weekend all your no opinion clone bookies got killed by sharps and squares.I know most of them personally.
Those with opinions or those who respect movement faired much better than those who don't.If you have no feeling on a game just write,if you love the Pats and their still betting you plus +4.5 go ahead and take a position plus 5.5 or 6. I take offence with people who,lets be honest here,have opened these sites primarily because of their unsuccessful gambling attempts advising people much brighter than them how to earn.
JMO.

[razor]

I obviously should have added,if you don't have a good opinion you should never gamble!
Let the #'s work for you. I personally would never risk my own money on some of these lines you see. Do you honestly believe any entity can make sharp lines on dozens of games a day,let alone the numerous props you see popping up. BTW "brighter than"was a bad choice of words in my previous post.You people are obviously much "brighter"than the people I refer to in running a gambling site.

SQUARESUCKER,

Your arguement makes no sense. In order to be a "WATCHDOG," then by definition, a person must be tuned into BOTH the Players Side and that of the Sports Book as well!

Just because we accept advertising revenues from Sports Books (as do many fine sites), does not disqualify us from helping out the PLAYERS, period.

Furthermore, we have always listed many sports books who do not advertise on The Prescription.

THE SHRINK

[Spearmaster]

In order to be a watchdog, a site must be impartial to both sides. It is clear that The Prescription does its best to do just that.

However, for someone like Ken to do this, there must be some cost involved as well. Since he does not ask for money from the players, he instead allows respectable sportsbooks to advertise on his site if they should so wish.

To me, that is how it should be. I face this same BS argument all the time on my site. But if you players want to donate to my cause, I will gladly give you an advertisement-free website.

Let's get real, squaresucker. Would YOU do all this work gratis? If you say yes, then go ahead and be our guest. I can't say that I'm rich enough to donate 14 hours a day to trying to provide quality information for casinos and players alike - and I could never expect Ken to do the same.

Unfortunately, as advertising is accepted, their will always be a perception of a conflict of interest.

However, where else in society are there such perceptions regarding "watchdogs"? How about newspapers - How many newspapers in the country accept advertising from Firestone? How many have crucified Firestone in their editorial pages?

How about television? How many millions do networks reap from advertising? How many of them have news programs where an investigative reporter jumps down someone's throat? How about 60 Minutes?

How about magazines?...etc....

Squaresucker, do you apply the same standards to these organizations? If so, then in your world the only watchdogs would be governmental agencies (since they do not accept advertising). Would you and everybody really be better off?...I think not.

[WildBill]

Shrink,

Back in sports betting's heyday in 94 in Vegas, I used to bet professionally. Most books in those days had guys like Jimmy V who didn't really sweat the action too much. They had leeway to let you bet a large amount and didn't seem to think much of it. They took action because they were real bookmakers, guys that knew you had to give a little to make a lot. Most good bookmakers want to have a balanced book, but won't do it at the expense of costing themselves action. In the end the books math is quite good as long as they have a lot of money coming in, even if it leads to many decisions.

Skip ahead now to 2000. The Horseshoe who used to boast about the biggest wagers allowed is an utter joke now! I saw people saying 1,000 online limits were weak, well what do they think about 1,000 limits on some college sides??? The Horseshoe like all other books has been absolutely gutted and its sad. The reason is that bookmakers and their superiors think just like you! Everything is a decision. Us against them. A good bookmaker will be well funded and long term oriented. I don't really know Jimmy V well but I am certain the change in mentality had a lot to do with switching back to the other side of the counter, and for good. There seems to be a divide offshore now as well. The books that seem to sweat the money and who chase off the wise guys like NASA and the books that welcome them to a degree and accept that decisions are not a terrible thing. Anyways when you look at it from a books perspective, most of the time the players would have to pick winners about 60% or more to beat them on their "decision" games.

My point in all this is if you were referring to real bookmakers then you missed the boat with this article. Bookmakers should not even be thought of as gamblers when it comes to their side of the counter. They are just taking the positivie side of a long term propostion. If they win this week should make no difference to them, they need to have a deep enough bankroll to cover themselves. Beyond that though, they shouldn't even be thinking of themselves as gamblers. Further almost all these head lines guys you seem to refer to should be allowed to gamble too don't you think? After all we all enjoy it and do if for fun, what are they not allowed to have fun? Most of them aren't betting anything near an amount that would cause them distress and further almost all of them are surely more focused on their jobs at hand. They should as a result of their line of work get a good feel for where the better line value is and where the sharper bettors are putting their money in. If they get an account with other books and play their own money I see nothing wrong with that, but I do see something wrong with you perpetuating the faulty thought processes of the lousy bookmakers that are growing in number these days.

[BettingProphets]

I am almost 100% positive SPIRO (Olympic) is a bettor. I dont know many Greeks that dont bet.

[WildBill]

Isn't that comment just a bit racist???

Thats pretty much what you hear in foreign countries about Americans and its pretty appaling stuff. I was in Mexico last year and one woman insisted that all American men cheat on their wives! I asked how she knew, she said, "EVERYONE KNOWS THAT!"

Besides in a time where we would all like to get authorities and the government off our backs isn't it a bit intrusive to make comments about someone's betting? Isn't that their own business? Shrink has not made one argument that should convince a personal bettor himself that betting is bad for us. Maybe for the owners or the line makers, but most of these operations surely don't seem ready to tank because of a couple of bad numbers. As it is now, a linemaker can only shade his numbers a bit, he really can't justify going way off the consensus worldwide line unless he has taken sufficient action to back it up.

WILDBILL,

My opinion was thrown out for a discussion. I do not see how taking a postition that Bookmakers who gamble are in more of a position to FAIL with their books than those who don't is racist. Now, that's quite a stretch!!

SOME of the offshore operators I am the friendliest with do gamble, but that doesn't mean I believe it is in their best interest to do so and I don't!!

I have already received some telephone calls from bookmakers who gamble. One of them "rationalizes" by saying he is not gambling when he bets but rather, he is "investing" since he always gets a favorable number.

Personally, I stand by my opinion in the column that it is NOT in the best interest of a sports book operator if they are booking bets and gambling at the same time.

Do I still have accounts with some of these sports books who gamble? Hell Yes!!!

Bottom Line...

If you REALLY believe that it is OK for a sports book to be gambling at the same time that they are bookmaking, please name me ONE elite sports book who is a succcessful at both????

Thanks,

THE SHRINK

[Horizon Sports]

Me Shrink!!!!

I win the weekly office pool at least three times during the course of the football season. LOL

It keeps in Subway Sandwiches throughout the year.

Doug Davidson

[SLAM DUNK]

Gambling with ones own money is fine, gambling with customers money isn't(that is irresponsible and puts the customers post up at risk). Of course it is a little hard to know exactly what a bookmaker is actually doing. If a book is keeping all of its customer balances (liabilities) liquid in a seperate bank account, that is adjusted say weekly, who cares what he does with his own money. If he wants to take a 100 K side on the Pats, and he has the 100 K to add to the till if he loses, isn't that his perogative. If he wants to gamble with an edge, I do not blame him, I consider it investing laying 11/10 so what would you call it for a skilled bettor getting 11/10(a much safer investment).

Out of curiousity, isn't it considered sharp bookmaking to shade your lines based off your sharp player's action? Isn't that in essence gambling? Smart gambling but gambling nonetheless.

[WildBill]

Are you going to tell me that Jimmy V didn't bet when he was booking at the Mirage??? He seemed to run a pretty good shop there at that time the premier sports book in the world. He gave it up because word around town was that he was making many times his sports book salary betting the games. I know everyone likes to jump on anyone that works as a tout, but word was that he was one of the best insider personnel at betting the games. The fact is though none of us really know who the best sports bettors are. Billy Walters was only known because the Computer Group got busted up, but there are quite a few very sterling players out there that none of you have ever heard of that regularly pull in couple hundred thousand a year and are not even part of any syndicates.

Hello group,

I hope I don't have to fade any heat because you guys have never seen a post from me in the past.


In my opinion The Shrink's original post has a problem with terminology.
It's not that the bookmaker who shouldn't bet, it's the LINEMAKER who shouldn't be betting with an establishment he supplies odds to.
Whether Jimmy V. (who I know) bet or did not bet is irrelevant.
But back in LV over the last 15+ year's it was Roxy (who I know too) who supplied the majority of the LV books with their odds that a cloud could have been over if he bet.
I want to make a point here that I never heard of Roxy making a sports bet once he created LVSC!!
The point being that an oddsmaker would have an conflict of interest if he was betting. But the bookie wouldn't.

Today who knows where some of these off-shore books get their line's. I'm guessing that they just copy the Don Best screen?? Plus many online books write that they have an in-house oddsmaker, yeah right??
LV didn't have enough qualified people over the last 20 years to run the sports books in town, let alone be an oddsmaker. But now we have a couple of hundred online books with oddsmakers?? I don't think so!!!

Personally if I owned an online sports book, I would let all the new-age bookies bet me juice free /infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif
Well all except that guy at___? /infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Cheers,
LV711
That's as in Yoooo Eleven not the damn store /infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

lv711,
welcome aboard...

Your post makes a lot of sense and your point is well-taken sir!!!

THE SHRINK

[The Major]

good post Ken.

[Judge Wapner]

I never understood why a Bm would want to bother betting.If they are running their book correctly,they are already on the right side.Why bet,and give up the vig.How much money does a person need.And,they already have action.

[The General]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> How much money does a person need <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

People never get enough once they got alot. GREED is ruining the world.

[THE SHRINK]

Thank you Major! http://therxforum.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

Perhaps you might want to pass this information along to your partner so he doesn't have to keep asking you and some of my friends for loans.... http://therxforum.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Next time you lend him money, make sure not to tell me because I don't give a rat's ass how much you lend him...

P.S.

Did he pay you back yet?

Be careful how you answer this because I might want to take you up on a wager regarding this...

THE SHRINK

[The Major]

Anything that Fred has every borrowed from me has been paid back and vice versa.

As far as I know Fred has not made a sports bet since I have known him. You could certainly ask him.

What are your thoughts on the owner of RIO being perhaps the largest DG gambler out there?

Imagine that coupled with a massive drug problem.

Would be a recipe for disastor I would speculate.

Thoughts Ken?

You wrote it I didnt...aristotle/shrink (btw that aristole thing must have really burned when you got caught)
http://therx.infopop.cc/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif http://therx.infopop.cc/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

http://therx.infopop.cc/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

[THE SHRINK]

Russ,

I don't have time to play with you anymore...

Don't you drink like a fish, too?

Just because I have been told you have difficulty getting it up when drunk (and sober) doesnt mean you have to attack everyone else who parties... http://theprescription.infopop.net/infopop/emoticons/icon_razz.gif

Freddy has lost lots of coin in casinos, even a worse proposition methinks...

Are YOU backing MajorBetting now that Pariaction is no more?

A simple yes or no will do...

Have a nice day and make sure to by some Viagra for those HARD times, lol... http://therxforum.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

P.S.

I find it rather pathetic that you and Freddie have to borrow from one another when you like to talk about money management being pivitol in this biz..

One would think you both could manage your funds better without borrowing from one another since you both don't gamble, right, lol?

Thanks,
Ken

[Mjulian]

"Engaging in excessive and wanton speculative activites betrays a reckless nature that is highly undesirable and at odds with the fiduciary responsibilities of the modern day bookmaker." -- Siggy


That kinda sums it the way I feel too.

I mean Jesus Christ would trust your bankroll in the hands of Dell Dude?!

[Fishhead]

Quote by Major...
Anything that Fred has ever borrowed from me has been paid back and vice versa.

The borrowing brothers! http://therxforum.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif http://therxforum.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_cool.gif

[lester]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Judge Wapner:
I never understood why a Bm would want to bother betting.If they are running their book correctly,they are already on the right side.Why bet,and give up the vig.How much money does a person need.And,they already have action.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

ego

[jersey joe]

Shrink-- how could you possibly say that Spiro doesn't bet.He's one of the biggest betters out there today.Also Olympic doesn't honor there numbers on the Don Best screen.

[bhbookie]

Russ - your a loser, theif, and liar.

Kenny - I also believe that bookmakers should not be gamblers. They are definately more likely to go under.

-scott

[WINNINGHAND]

Shrink you are wrong on this one. Olympic's Spiro and Pinnacle's Henry are the biggest gamblers in the world. You guys who think that because they gamble, that their business is compromised are completely wrong. With the information they have, I would probably bet too. Betting doesn't seem to be hurting their business at all. Also, people may confuse betting with laying off, which actually diminishes the sportsbooks risk. It doesn't bother me one bit that Olympic, Rio, or Pinnacle gamble as long as i get paid every week, which i have by all of the above.

[The Major]

Scott

Nothing personal but IMO you should stop with the silly little kiddy type posts and try and get your business up and running. You have a responsibility to the people who trusted you with their money to provide a service and here you are calling people names all day long.

Time well spent Scott.

[The General]

Same ol Song, Same ol Dance. I even tire of listening to Shania after awhile.

Good day gentlemen.

http://www.therx.com/forum/grem/marsububu.gif

[bhbookie]

Would you agree that the smaller books (thousands of them) would be more at risk if they gambled.

No one can make a statement that will be true in ALL scenarios. But for the most part he is correct.

extreme example #1 - If a book pulls in 10 million a year in profit, then the owners betting 5k a game makes no difference.

extreme example #2 - If a book does not make a lot of money and the owner bets over his or her head, there is a HUGE chance of them going under.

There are ALWAYS exeptions to the rule.

[Country Dick Montana]

Sounds like some bookmakers are beating Shrink to the numbers he wants. Shrink, with all due respect, at LEAST two of the books you mentioned as NOT gambling, have bookmakers, who I know for a fact are gamblers. It is also strongly believed in the industry that Spiro gambles (I can not vouch for that.). What I consider to be THE TWO SHARPEST SHOPS in the world GAMBLE. Out of respect for them I will not mention names, but many here could guess could venture a guess. Also many BM's gamble using their book. They simply move the line they like a half point, let others bet them and lay the juice. Different, but still gambling. I have a gut feeling there is more to this post than meets the eye.

[bhbookie]

MAJOR - Your probably the one behind these attacks, it would fit your agenda perfectly.

We are doing all we can right now. But whenever I see you post here (cause like I said before "your site sucks") I will gladly remind you of what kind of person you are.
http://www.therx.com/forum/grem/1041579183.gif (Im the guy on the left, you are on the right)

-scott

[Judge Wapner]

How you been Country.Yeah,alot of Bms bet and alot of them win.But I still don't get it.

[bhbookie]

BM's should not gamble. And shading the lines are just as bad.

It increases their chances to get buried on games. I know its not as eciting for you guys to bet at a shop with "non-opinionated" lines, but at least you know we keep the money so we can pay you when you request it.

-scott

[Country Dick Montana]

Judge,

Doing well thank you. I don't gamble myself, simply because my opinion sucks. My "Inner Square" always gets the best of me. If I actually thought I could turn a profit, it would be tempting.

[WINNINGHAND]

Scott, i heard that you went on a diet to try and lose 30 pounds before new years. Is this true? Also, could you share your secrets. Are you on Atkins, or another one? good luck with your diet. http://therx.infopop.cc/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

[DickyW]

LMAO at this thread! Linesmakers and operators should'nt gamble, ahhh ok! Someone must really have a talk with that spyro clown. I suppose taking on movers with huge limits is'nt gambling huh?

[lakerfan]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> MAJOR - Your probably the one behind these attacks, it would fit your agenda perfectly.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Take my advice and quit representing your book in such a shitty way.

You will be better off staying out of forum wars.

[DickyW]

I also heard the major was the second gunman behing the grassy knoll

[SENDITIN]

Shrink,

Do you consider shading lines to draw in action on a particular side gambling or bookmaking?
I was of the understanding that the smaller books MUST take positions on games to make money because matchup vig does not cover expenses.

[Judge Wapner]

Dicky when I was making lines I bet.That's because I was on salary and always looking for an extra score.Just don't understand why the owners would bet.Like you said they take big ass hits.

[Otherwize]

Shrink on Rio owner's wagering (http://therxforum.com/6/ubb.x?a=tpc&s=100090022&f=988094022&m=74810257&r=65510457#65510457)<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> I also know for a fact that one of the owners of RIO wagers more in one week than Majorbetting's entire bankroll.. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

[DickyW]

Judge
I don't think I know a linesguy that does'nt play.The only thing I don't do is bet against the house.

[The General]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by DickyW:
I also heard the major was the second gunman behing the grassy knoll<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

http://therxforum.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

[Judge Wapner]

Dicky,exactly.That was the biggest fringe benefits of the job,having the charts in front of you.Best handicapping tool I ever saw.

[The General]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> Best handicapping tool I ever saw. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Wish I had those http://therxforum.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_frown.gif

[Francesalbert]

Shrink you have to change your stance on this issue. Back 3.5 years ago when you started this thread you had to feel different about these types of shops then you do now.

Russel you need to find a more suitable hobby staying on the forums looking over posts on sites for the last decade and jerking off is not good for you. How does it work again? Every 3 hours in front of your computer accumulating blod clots is equal to one whack off session? You have a lot of catching up to do.

Russel how are you doing as an agent for the books these days? Word on the street is you have packages with a few books but called many more that turned you down for a package of your wise guys. Wise guys that do not pay from what I hear. Well they had a good role model for not paying debts Russel. Remember those good ole Vegas days?

[Francesalbert]

Amazing how Major throws stones but has a ton of Skeletons in his closet.

Like his buddy Mark Del going under and keeping his mouth shut. Word is these two still talk to this day and why not Major didn't do anything but profit off the guy.

Like his buddy and ex partner Anthony from securebuxx.

Like his ownership of a slow paying sportsbook majorbetting. ( I know you have nothing to do with that )



Like his owing his balls out to many people ( I know you want me to name them ) How is life hiding out in Canada like ?



Like his advertisers that he owes money to and keeps them up on his site for free.

Like his constant asking different sportsbooks if he can place a package of players in there book and get a sheet. ( Major you cannot put yourself,Anthony, and five other dummy names in a book and get a half sheet. Dude, these books are not as dumb as you ) Please stop trying to f~CK the only source of revenue you have.

[Gringo in CR]

I'm I the only one that noticed that the major bought back a 3 year old thread? Are you that board? Go crank one off in the bathroom. http://www.therx.com/forum/grem/applaudit.gif

[THE SHRINK]

Gringo,

Yes, this thread was started by me over THREE YEARS ago and at that time, I don't believe Spiros was gambling...

Russ is so desparate that he brings back topics OVER THREE YEARS AGO, twists things around, hoping that someone will believe him...

It is REALLY time for sports books to take notice that RUSS may very well treat you as he did RIO if you don't renew your advertising on MW...

The ironic thing is that many of the sports books I get together with have told me they don't pay to be listed there. You only pay to come off... http://therxforum.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

And Russ, when are you going to pay back ALL the guys in VEGAS that you STIFFED?

THE SHRINK

[Fishhead]

Cabin fever is setting in on Major.

[Sr Muny]

Major and partner have been decieving from the begining.

Word was they had part of TOW SPORTS from the begining, then later opened majorbetting.

This is nothin new for these CLOWNS to be hiding behind false rumors and forum post.

[just once]

It's to bad the shrinks boy from Rio gambles "Roy"

[Railbird]

If the Bookmaker can afford to gamble like at Pinnacle its Ok, but when someone has to BORROW to gamble like the devil at Majorbetting it is wrong.

[wilheim]

....