Judge Rules Poker Champ Robbed Casino!!

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Judge John Mitting [ruled] that “by using the croupier as his innocent agent or tool,” Ivey “gave himself an advantage which the game precludes. This is in my view cheating.”

PHIL IVEY is a CHEATER!
 

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Incredible that he pulled the same sleazy move at the Borgata weeks later, and got paid!
 
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[h=1]'I'm getting a second shot': Poker ace accused of cheating by exclusive Mayfair gaming club may get back his £8million winnings in court appeal[/h]
  • Phil Ivey was refused his winnings after a London casino said he cheated
  • Mayfair club Crockfords claimed he broke the rules of game punto banco
  • Mr Ivey, the world's top poker player, said he used a legitimate technique
  • His appeal has 'a real prospect of success' according to a judge's ruling
By Ian Gallagher for The Mail on Sunday
Published: 20:55 EST, 28 November 2015 | Updated: 12:00 EST, 29 November 2015

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The poker player denied £7.8 million in winnings after a London casino accused him of cheating has spoken for the first time about the case as a landmark legal decision gave him fresh hope of recovering the money.
The owners of Mayfair gaming club Crockfords claimed Phil Ivey, 39, had broken the rules when playing the card game punto banco, a form of baccarat, in August 2012.
Mr Ivey, the world’s leading poker player, insisted he used a legitimate technique known as edge sorting – but a High Court action he brought against the casino for non-payment of winnings failed last year.
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+2


Second shot: The world's best poker player Phil Ivey (pictured) is being given a chance to get back £7.8million worth of winnings from Mayfair gaming club Crockfords, which accused him of cheating

However, Mr Ivey has now been granted permission to appeal after a judge ruled that his case raises an important question of law and has ‘a real prospect of success’.
‘This is really great news. I am getting a second shot and I’m hoping we will win this time around,’ Mr Ivey told The Mail on Sunday yesterday.
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‘It is not in my nature to cheat, which is why I was so bitterly disappointed by the judge’s decision a year ago, even though he said I was a truthful witness.’
Mr Ivey exploited tiny flaws in the design of the cards – asymmetrical pattern differences on the back edges created in the manufacturing process.
This is really great news. I am getting a second shot and I’m hoping we will win this time around.
Poker player Phil Ivey


‘When you are a professional gambler you are always looking for ways to gain an advantage over the casino,’ he said. ‘It’s their job to prevent me from having any advantage. Sometimes I come out on top, sometimes they do.’
When he finished playing after two nights he was told his winnings would be wired to him. ‘It was all pretty amicable but after a few days the money hadn’t turned up,’ said Mr Ivey who has never spoken out about the case.
In court last year, Genting Casinos UK, which owns Crockfords, argued that edge sorting was not a legitimate strategy and constituted cheating.
They said their croupier was tricked into helping the gambler after he pretended to be superstitious. He convinced staff to let him play repeatedly with a single pack of ‘lucky’ cards that had a pattern suited to edge sorting.
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Back to court: Mr Ivey insists that the technique he was using - known as edge sorting - is a legitimate technique. Mr Ivey (pictured outside the High Court in London in 2014) has been granted permission to appeal after a judge ruled that his case has ‘a real prospect of success’

The latest chapter in the long-running dispute is due to be played out at the Appeal Court on December 10. Mr Ivey’s lawyers will argue that cheating involves dishonesty, yet the judge found that he was not dishonest.
Mr Ivey, who lives in Las Vegas and has won the Poker World Series ten times, said yesterday: ‘When you’re accused of cheating it’s a very big deal in gambling. I’m not allowed in certain casinos because of what happened.
'But my colleagues have been tremendously supportive – they know what is cheating and what is not.’
 

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calling what he did cheating is absurd. the real absurdity is that the casino
and its highly paid supervisory staff could be so clueless that they let this
go on for as it did.
 

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calling what he did cheating is absurd. the real absurdity is that the casino
and its highly paid supervisory staff could be so clueless that they let this
go on for as it did.

how do we know at least one casino employee wasn't in on it? then would it be cheating?

i think it was cheating either way...he and his accomplice played the game in a manner intended to defraud the casino by knowing which cards were which. no different than marking the cards yourself
 

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all of his terms were negotiated in advance with the casino. at no point in any of the trials
has there ever been mention of ANY inside help from ANY of the casino staff.
the casinos' GREED blinded them to the fact that IVY was able to manipulate
a game which had a GUARANTEED HOUSE ADVANTAGE to a game where he had
an advantage. truly it was a thing of beauty and NOT cheating.
 
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how do we know at least one casino employee wasn't in on it? then would it be cheating?

i think it was cheating either way...he and his accomplice played the game in a manner intended to defraud the casino by knowing which cards were which. no different than marking the cards yourself

I disagree 100%. It's the same as counting cards in blackjack...
 

schmuck
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it's a little bit more than counting as he did manipulate the casino into a few
concessions under less than totally straightforward/transparent reasoning.
however the casinos did agree and IVY did NOT cheat, but he did manipulate.
 

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fair enough guys

counting cards only provides an edge when count is in your favor... edge sorting it's impossible to lose

and counting cards doesn't require manipulating the game (having dealer turn low cards one way/high cards the other, and use manual shuffle/same deck)
 
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all of his terms were negotiated in advance with the casino. at no point in any of the trials
has there ever been mention of ANY inside help from ANY of the casino staff.
the casinos' GREED blinded them to the fact that IVY was able to manipulate
a game which had a GUARANTEED HOUSE ADVANTAGE to a game where he had
an advantage. truly it was a thing of beauty and NOT cheating.

+10000

they agreed to those terms, if they beat Ivey would they return the $ based on his unfair advantage? Thin line there, moral grounds, greed, call it what you want. Casino is a sore loser. Fuck em.
 

schmuck
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casinos do as much possible to throw one off their game + discipline to maximize the
players chances of losing. this incudes free booze, access to credit, and etc.
however when a player wins legally but by exploiting +EV opportunities such
as mr. walters in sports, blackjack counters, and mr ivy; these huge corporations
cry like little girls and run to use the laws and regulations they helped set up
which are highly skewed towards the house and against the players.
 
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casinos do as much possible to throw one off their game + discipline to maximize the
players chances of losing. this incudes free booze, access to credit, and etc.
however when a player wins legally but by exploiting +EV opportunities such
as mr. walters in sports, blackjack counters, and mr ivy; these huge corporations
cry like little girls and run to use the laws and regulations they helped set up
which are highly skewed towards the house and against the players.

yep, they are bullies pretty much that run and cry to the principal when the geek punched back
 

EV Whore
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all of his terms were negotiated in advance with the casino. at no point in any of the trials
has there ever been mention of ANY inside help from ANY of the casino staff.
the casinos' GREED blinded them to the fact that IVY was able to manipulate
a game which had a GUARANTEED HOUSE ADVANTAGE to a game where he had
an advantage. truly it was a thing of beauty and NOT cheating.

casinos do as much possible to throw one off their game + discipline to maximize the
players chances of losing. this incudes free booze, access to credit, and etc.
however when a player wins legally but by exploiting +EV opportunities such
as mr. walters in sports, blackjack counters, and mr ivy; these huge corporations
cry like little girls and run to use the laws and regulations they helped set up
which are highly skewed towards the house and against the players.

Yes and yes.
 

I like money
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Professional poker player Phil Ivey didn't cheat when he won $9.6 million playing baccarat at an Atlantic City casino, but a judge also ruled the former New Jersey resident still might have to pay back the money, according to reports.
Sitting in Camden, U.S. District Judge Noel Hillman said Ivey and an associate were liable for breach of contract when they won the money at the Borgata Hotel Casino & Spa over a four-day period in 2012. The judge ruled that the pair didn't commit fraud, though.
The judge's ruling was first reported by NorthJersey.com.
Ivey and Cheng Yin Sun employed a technique called "edge-sorting" in which players detect small manufacturer defects in the cards and use it to their advantage.
Hillman said that Ivey and Yin Sun altered the odds to their advantage and in doing so violated the Casino Control Act. The Borgata has 20 days to outline what Ivey owes and then Ivey has 20 days to respond, according to NJLawJournal.com.
Ivey allegedly had Yin Sun ask the dealer to rotate high value cards 90 degrees, which moved the flaw on the card back to the opposite corner and made it identifiable.
Ivey also insisted that a shuffling machine be used (which keeps the cards from being spun and altered) essentially setting up a deck where he was able to identify the value of the next card off the deck to a certain degree.
Ivey says card manufacturer Gemaco was responsible for producing cards within contractual and industry standards. He also says the Borgata knew the card manufacturing process didn't produce perfectly symmetrical card backs and later destroyed the deck of cards so they couldn't be used as evidence.
On one lucrative day, he won $4.8 million in 17 hours by betting an average of $89,000 a hand, according to Court House News Service.
The Borgata learned of Ivey's technique after officials there read a report about a London casino withholding $12.4 million he won playing a game similar to baccarat in 2012. A judge ruled in the casino's favor, but Ivey is appealing.
He is also counter-suing the Borgata.
Born in California, Ivey spent much of his childhood in Roselle before moving to Old Bridge as a teenager. He is a 1995 Old Bridge High School graduate.
Jeff Goldman may be reached at jeff_goldman@njadvancemedia.com. Follow him on Twitter @JeffSGoldman. Find NJ.com on Facebook.
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