Barry Bonds, pictures tell the story

monicus · Mar 28, 2004

I lived in Pittsbugh most of my life and I tell people Barry was not that big when he played in the Burgh but these pictures tell the story.

Barry in 1991 age 27
6' 1" 185 lbs
25 HR's

http://cache.gettyimages.com/comp/1378552.jpg?x=x&dasite=MS_GINS&ef=2&ev=1&dareq=E2399169AC85D6DE0B18E813F18315F7EDAC94111D5099D5

Barry in 2001 age 37
6' 1" 228 lbs
73 HR's

Ex-teammate Andy Van Slyke weighs (ha) in:

"Unequivocally he's taken them," Van Slyke said. "I can say that with utmost certainty. Now, I never saw him put it into his body, but look ... the physical evidence is there. People do not gain 35 pounds of muscle in their late 30s without a little bit of help.

"When I played with him, I weighed more than him and yet he was still a tremendous player. He still had good power, and he was an MVP. The physical facts are the physical facts, and when you're 36, 37 and 38 years old is not when you peak with your home run production."

Journeyman · Mar 28, 2004

I can`t help but always think of Lyle Alzado when it comes to steroid abuse...

My Most Wanted Baseball Roider`s List

Crooks of the game; McGwire, Bonds, Sosa, Giambi, Canseco, Caminitti, Brady Anderson, Dykstra, Puhols, Boone Bros, Juan Gonzales(injury riddled after he bulked up) Jeff Bagwell (just a hunch) Nomar, Sheffield, (Bonds training buddy) Strawberry, (really bulked up at one point)

A few abberations worth wondering about, most people when they get heavy into steroids there body`s beome very injury prone, Bonds seems to be less injury prone since he bulked up....And one player I cant figure out is Raffy Palmeiro, he is closing in on 600 Hr`s and looks like a normal guy (at best) and very unlikely steroid user...Palmeiro wasn`t even a power hitter when he first came up making his 600 Hr`s even more remarkable..

SSI · Mar 28, 2004

i can tell you that without a doubt, i can put on muscle right now (at age 36) than at anytime in my life, ive worked out since the age of 15.. the body peaks physically in the mid to late 30's now.. Look at the Mr. Olympia's, all are over 35 now. Ronnie Coleman is near 40 and is the reigning Mr. O. and dont use steroids as an example because all of the competitors at the Mr. Olympia use them.. It is very easy to put on 30lbs of muscle in 10 years naturally, if your busting your rear end, in the gym.. Im sure that Barry probably did them but guys ive never touched them and i can state without a doubt that ive went from 205 to 225 in the last 6-7yrs without any roids or any help.. My body responds very well now, it is simply peaking, this is spoken from experience.. Jman can you relate to what im saying.. I have a drug free 37yr old friend, who is in the best muscle shape of his life and he has lifted for about 19yrs now and is also peaking..

Journeyman · Mar 28, 2004

I can relate to gaining muscle over many many years... But, I am sure these athletes who are at the very top, have every advantage in life, whether it be nutrition, medical care or a 'drug coach' if you will...and many have taken full advantage..There is too much circumstancial evidence to overlook...But a couple things should be noted when all the steroid rage started (which is much earlier than anyone realized at the time) steroids were not illegal in baseball back then...When Brady Anderson hit his 50 and when Lenny Dykstra gained all that weight and became a great player, no one was questioning them (funny to think back now) It wasn`t illegal...it was still IMO shady, and not good for baseball...

Cheating to gain an advantage in sports isn`t going to go away...There is rampant cheating in the Olympics (Mark Spitz probably cheated even) Ben Johnson, Carl Lewis etc. which has gone on forever, cheating in Nascar, pitchers will try to scuff baseball`s Gaylord Perry would not be in the HOF , Don Sutton etc...I`m sure many many basketball players take the too...They all are ripped to shreds now...and then there is masking agents to mask the steroids,its been a game of cat and mouse in strength sports for decades, baseball has just now finally gotten caught thats all, the list goes on and on...

Many people can gain muscle ass in their 30`s , I just highly doubt these athletes have done it the old fashioned way...I do wonder how the rest of their lives will be say 20 years from now when they have heart, liver and kidney trouble...

These drugs kill people at an alarming rate, I wonder why thats not being mentioned much?
The Pro wrestler`s are dropping like fly`s , dying of heart failure in their sleep at 45, more emphasis should be on the health risks attatched to this crap IMO...The media should be more responsible here...

Journeyman · Mar 28, 2004

I have no doubt about your friend still peaking as you say....I think its a myth that a man peaks physically around 35, someone who has maintained their fitness their whole life should have no problem looking the same ...But we are talking about MLB here and the elite of the elite, so many things go into the equasion of being able to still hit a baseball late in your 30`s or at 40, its mind boggling IMO...

SSI · Mar 28, 2004

Jman, its not the use but the misuse that kills, here is the scenario. Lets look at Dianbol or Testosterone, The way you do it, is in an 8 week cycle:

Week 1: 1/2 cc each
Week 2: 1 cc each
Week 3: 1.5 cc each
Week 4: 2 cc each
Week 5: 2 cc each
Week 6: 1.5 cc each
Week 7: 1 cc each
Week 8: 1/2 cc each
This is followed by 8 weeks off all drugs.

This is the correct way to cycle the drugs safely, the trouble comes about week 7, thats when you start to lose some of the strength and mass that you gained and when it comes time to go on your off 8 weeks, you will decrease the 8 weeks to 6 weeks, then to 4 weeks, then to 2 weeks and before you know it, there are no off weeks.. Its the misuse and not the use Jman.. Pumping some serious iron will increase your strength greatly. I never homered in a game until i was 15 yrs old, coincidentally i started pumping iron the winter before my 15yr old season.. You can add great distance to your homers by pumping iron only, again spoken from experience.. Muscle Maturity comes in the mid to late 30's Jman, thats a fact, ask Joe Weider. Im not talking about speed or hand/eye cooridination, im talking about mature muscle mass that is required to win the Mr. Olympia. No way a 20yr old can beat a 35yr old in a Mr. Olympia contest, it cannot happen because muscle maturity hasnt occurred, go back and read the ages of this years Mr. Olympia.. Ronnie Coleman is 37 or 38 and the baddest man on the planet..

RobFunk · Mar 28, 2004

here's a pic of coleman, I had never seen him before

TheFunkMonkey · Mar 28, 2004

Correct, muscle maturity tends to peak in the 30s. Some attributes (speed, quickness) tend to peak in the teens/20s, but not muscle maturity.

Whether or not Bonds used steroids, I don't know. But it drives me nuts when people assume that a player is using steroids simply because he gained 20-30 pounds of muscle.

So what, 20-30 pounds of muscle? You have to realize that many of these players don't lead a "normal" life. They NEVER eat junk food. They have personal chefs and trainers. They take dozens of legal supplements. They train 4-5 hours per day during the off-season.

They're world-class athletes. Of course they're going to be bigger and stronger than the rest of us. On top of that, they probably have a genetic advantage when it comes to adding muscle mass. That genetic advantage is one of the reasons they're world-class athletes!

Also, keep in mind that the people who are asking the questions (the media) aren't exactly the most healthy people. Many of them don't get any exercise other than walking down the buffet line before/during/after the game. They don't understand what can be accomplished with proper nutrition and exercise.

Journeyman · Mar 28, 2004

I don`t know enough to say if taking steroids in moderation is safe...I`m not sure anyone can say for sure? Can you really say moderate steroid use is safe?

As far as this thread goes , I agree the body development at 35,36,37 is still potentially greater (most have given up by then though) but at the same time hitting MLB is a different story...With injuries and wear and tear it is mind boggling to stay consistent for 20 yrs ,like a Murray or Bonds or even Fred McGriff, alot of greats fizzle out by 35...

JohnnyDeMarco · Mar 28, 2004

SSI is right on. Throw Decca in that mix he's talking about, eat right (huge key) get cardio and proper weight training- you'll be a monster.

monicus · Mar 28, 2004

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> Throw Decca in that mix he's talking about, eat right (huge key) get cardio and proper weight training- you'll be a monster. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

If it is just that easy why are there only a few players who seem to able to do it. Why are there not more 38 year old 50+ HR hitters? So what you are saying is that Bonds is the only player who eats right and trians hard? The other 30+ year old players should contact Bonds's trainer so they can get his diet and workout plan, because like you said "eat right and trian hard" is all takes. Oh wait, Bonds's trainer is being investigated for being involved in a steroid distribution ring.

SSI · Mar 28, 2004

no, i said Bonds probably took them, but my point was that it is easy to add 30lbs of muscle in 4-5yrs through proper nutrition and busting your rear in the gym, thats all i was saying.. and on that note and GT victory, im going to the gym to work "Chest and Triceps" now..

SSI · Mar 28, 2004

Jman, if there wasnt a proper way to do them, then doctors wouldnt give them out.. Surgeries, burn victims, lots of reasons to do them.. The key is to use them safe, the problem comes with the fact -- that the guys wont get off them, they will use them year around because of the mental affects of losing the mass, when they cycle off them.. they may gain 10lbs of muscle in the 8 weeks on, and then drop 6 of it during the 8 weeks off,, they cant stand that part of it, mentally..

Journeyman · Mar 28, 2004

I`m not going to get into a big debate on whether steroids are safe long term, I always thought a doctor giving them out for someone to heal was alot different than someone cycling on and off of them for years though...

I call it the "musclehead curse" , once someone see`s they can build up their body they want more and more, and its never enough! Many weightlifter types suffer from this mental curse, its has the same effect as an anorexic person....The weightlifter never thinks he`s big enough, I have seen this so often...

SSI · Mar 28, 2004

your right jman, they cant get off them.. thats where the problems lie.. hey Jman, im going for my personal bests this summer in the bench and trying to lose weight along the way... due to 3 family deaths last year and illness associated with them, i didnt train much, but have been hitting it hard for the last month..

Today: weight 238lbs, i benched 225lbs for 10 reps today and also 250lbs for
6 reps, Goal #1 is a 225lb bodyweight and 225lbs for 20 reps in the
bench and Goal #2 is a 217lb bodyweight and 250lbs for 15 reps on the
bench.. I hope to reach Goal #1 in 2 months and Goal #2 in 4 months.

JohnnyDeMarco · Mar 28, 2004

Monicus,
Just because you look real good doesnt mean you can hit a baseball. Hitting a MLB pitcher is supposedly the hardest thing to do in sports. Hitting the juice makes you hit the ball harder and makes what would be routine fly balls homers. You still have to hit the ball square-juice has nothing to do with that other than enabling tremendous bat speed.

monicus · Mar 28, 2004

John,

No one said hitting a baseball is easy, and I never said Barry couldn't hit. The point of the thread is that Barry seems to have had a large increase in size and HR production at an age when most guys retire. Name another player in any sport who has doubled his scoring in his late 30's versus his 20's. It is unnatural to 70 HR's when your 37 and to have never hit more than 50 HR's when you were in your prime.

RobFunk · Jun 8, 2004

sorry to dig this up but. . .

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Ronnie Coleman is near 40 and is the reigning Mr. O. and dont use steroids as an example <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>I talked to one of the trainers at the gym today. And there are posters of various body builders up, but none of MR.Coleman. So I asked him why he did not have a poster of Coleman up, since he is 'drug free' (I had remembered reading this here at the RX) and he just laughed his head off ("RONNY COLEMAN??!? HAHAHAHA" is what the gentleman did.) and said that Coleman has been on roids for 20 years and said his physique as a body builder isnt that great with everything most especially his thighs being so disporportionate.

Journeyman · Jun 8, 2004

I never believed he was anything BUT artificial....why anyone risks their health for that is just nuts!

I like looking back at old threads though, I wonder if SSI reached his goal?

Its all about being consistent...very hard the older one gets...for me the only thing that slows be down is the damn winter

How are you doing Rob?

RobFunk · Jun 8, 2004

i cant get focused journey. . .i goof off with the diet and beer too much. . i wish i could cool it, hopefully at some point i will i dont think i have ever reached my body's potential. . .curious to see if SSI reached his goal also. . .journey and sick G two most muscular posters at the RX?! unless sick is full of crap when he said he could bench 300+, but i believe him for some reason. . .you da man sick