------>>> Your Right to GAMBLE Online is being attacked in September -- VOTE against this here --

IntuitionBET · Aug 8, 2003

Lawmakers have indicated the full Senate will vote on S. 627 when Congress returns from their August recess in September. This is why it’s so urgent you and your friends send letters to Congress telling them to vote against this attack on your freedom!

Click here to VOTE against this
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Are you going to click on the link above and at least make an effort to try to HELP SAVE Online Gambling Entertainment as we know it today?

suetoneous · Aug 8, 2003

Intuition, I don't believe anything in "writing" will be persuasive. I think a better approach is for gamblers and freedom lovers to bombard the consevative talk-shows and point out this blatant hypocracy. This subject is nowhere to be found on any of their programs

Rush Limbaugh, for example, has spend his whole adult life lampooming and condemning the democrats for their intrusive laws, treating us all like a pack of children. The republicans are now doing the same thing here.

Maybe WildBill can produce some talking points...

UncleButternutts · Aug 8, 2003

It's worth a shot.
Thanks for the continued efforts IBet

WildBill · Aug 8, 2003

Talking points? Where do we start???

I don't know, everyone of these guys has different hot buttons. For that reason alone I usually say don't bother with a blanket statement type of message to your representative because they know you just got it done for you on a website and so often their staffers just ignore it. Best thing to do is get some time on the phone or in person with a staffer of theirs, this being the Senate chances aren't good you get to meet the person firsthand. Don't talk as a gambler per se, talk as a person that worries about infringement on rights in general. Tell them that you think things are hypocritical that the state tries to goad you into gambling where they get money, yet if you don't want to play their game they consider you a criminal and somehow a threat to society. Tell them that the internet is the world's communication tool and that it should continue to be an unfettered medium, that by trying to pass such rules we are opening it up to the lowest common denominator. If we try to impose some sort of moral standard on it we are no better than the Iranians who block discussions that aren't conforming to strict Islam. That one always gets a good rub out of them, comparing our government to that of Iran, but it sticks with them. Being controversial is no crime because if you are just Joe Average normal citizen with a simple voice, it won't be heard. You either need money or a really "out there" point or else you will be as forgotten as the next guy that gives 30 minutes of his time to basically be ignored.

oldmantime · Aug 8, 2003

Or you might take this approach:
Freedom Of Speech

Tell the staffer that you believe it infringes on your freedom of speech, just as limiting campaign contributions limits "free speech".

greg · Aug 9, 2003

I am asking my senators if they will endorse a bill subjecting a law abiding citizen to 5 years in jail for funding an offshore casino with 50 dollars to play a few hands of blackjack, and how do they justify this with prison overcrowding/expenses as well stepping on the right to pursue happiness /privacy

oldmantime · Aug 9, 2003

P - pP PPP--Did somebody say "prison".

Wild Bill says it gonna happen. (I think dats what he said)

Wild Man are you around?

IntuitionBET · Aug 9, 2003

oldmantime - WildBill seems to know more about this than most...let's see if he replies

oldmantime · Aug 10, 2003

Yes IB, I agree. he is knowledgable. I really hope that he responds again to this one.

I had a BAD DREAM last night.

Let this all be over soon!

WildBill · Aug 10, 2003

Oh please, are you kidding me? While the final language of the bill is still likely to be amended I see no way they include prison terms for gamblers. As it reads now, I believe but am not certain, the prison terms are just for operators of gambling businesses. The chances of them making it a crime to bet are near zero because I am told that brings them into dubious territory for no reason. They know that prosecutors aren't going to enforce this on the thousands of gamblers, but even more important anytime you specifically outlaw an activity that has generally been regarded as a state right, then you invite trouble both with opposing senators as well as courts.

So I would rest easy, chances of anyone going to prison are extremely low, make that impossibly low.

suetoneous · Aug 10, 2003

If the republicans get control of both branches (House, Senate, Executive) I think it’s likely they will then go after the gambler. But for now they just want *something*. Eventually, I think we’ll have a new federal agency, or maybe a dept. created within the FBI… dedicated to routing out all internet gamblers . The stated purpose will, of course, be to protect our children… and prevent Al Queada operatives from using sportsbooks to funnel money to their US cells. But the real purpose will be to seize the personal property of the gambler.

sean8499 · Aug 10, 2003

How can anyone end up in prison for placing an online wager when its not even a crime in most states??? NYS courts have already decreed that the existing gaming laws do not apply to the bettor. However, bookmakers and anyone else who profits from operating a gambling enterprise are vulnerable to prosecution.

WildBill · Aug 10, 2003

Exactly and if they try to do something then it becomes an issue. Stopping terrorism has always been a federal issue, stopping or regulating gambling has always been a state issue. Many legal experts claim that there is enough precedent in this to overturn the Bradley law that bars most states from sports gambling, just that no one has challenged it yet. Bottom line is that almost certainly the states will have to punish gamblers themselves if they want to criminalize it.

And as for setting up a department to stop gambling, you got to be f!@#in kidding!!! Can you imagine them try to justify that? They can get away with that argument right now because once you are elected you don't have to justify things such as this, but once they start putting millions into budgets to stop something that most people don't care about you cross a line. The doom and gloom I hear on this board is incredible. You all think they just invented this concept of gambling when they got the internet or something? There have been attempts to stop sports gambling for over 100 years, yet they have never gone as far as to put gamblers in jail, nor have the really done much to anyone who wasn't heavily tied into the mob. Why should this day and age where so much higher a percentage of the population is gambling and where most of the world allows it lead to this sudden tight prohibition with hundreds of gamblers going to jail? It plain and simple doesn't make sense. Remember the concept of a smell test. I think if all of us on this board read the idea of a federal agency to stamp out gambling long enough, the stench will be sickening. Mark my words, its not going to happen. There might be a new little law that gets a lot of backslapping going in DC and a bunch of religious types may hail Congress for doing this deed, but anyone who has been paying attention to this process over the years will quickly agree there will not be anything passed that remotely kills off this industry. If Congress is lucky it will slow down its growth a bit, but its not going to stop.

TheGeneral+ · Aug 11, 2003

Whatever approach is taken, it is a help, whether a letter, a phone call, or a face to face. Thanks for the efforts IB. And thank for the input by all here. Good work in sharing of ideas.

IntuitionBET · Aug 13, 2003

WildBill - Good point. They can't shut this down as it's too big and has been going on for too many years. If they were able to stop all sportwagering nationwide WHO would be left to watch Monday Night Football? No one!

With the cooperation the Feds are giving Panama to keep offshore sportsbetting clean and free of money laundering...I think is a HINT of what maybe around the corner. What are your thought on that?

WildBill · Aug 13, 2003

I don't know, lets see how exactly it shakes out. What will kill off Panama is if they share any records with the IRS, something I would highly doubt they do. IRS and the Justice Department don't work together and aren't allowed to legally swap information. I think the way to keep money laundering out is to simply put rules on how much money can be taken in and out. While some may not like this, is there really a reason for a serious bettor to put over 10 dimes into a place and take out the same amount within a couple of days? Probably not. I would just suggest a 10 dime limit on withdrawls per week and you will get rid of almost any thoughts of money laundering. The very few that would be affected by this in a negative way could make arrangements and subject themselves to a minimum of plays to get around it as most launderers are going to do a minimal amount of play before trying to get "clean" money out.

Amitightornot · Aug 13, 2003

Will Bill, do you work for a law firm?
Do you have email address?

IntuitionBET · Aug 13, 2003

WildBill - Yes. If they can keep the money laundering out of Panama, Panama will do well. I would believe that Panama would have some mechanism in placer to prevent this but you point about limits would work as well.

WildBill · Aug 13, 2003

Nope, never worked for a law firm and the times in my job when I deal with lawyers boy do I cringe! If anyone wants to write (say to offer me a good job, hehe) my "gambling related" email is fadethedog@hotmail.com

IntuitionBET · Aug 15, 2003

WildBill - Thanks for your input. You're an asset here at the Rx

------>>> Your Right to GAMBLE Online is being attacked in September -- VOTE against this here --

------>>> Your Right to GAMBLE Online is being attacked in September -- VOTE against this here --

Yes. I clicked on the link to send the form to my Representative and Senator

I've already sent the form to my Representative and Senator

No I don't really care to help out unless I get a BONUS or something

No I don't think this will help

I think it's too late and Online Gambling in the U.S. will be maded illegal

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