My latest creation...The great debate, battle of the POSTERS,Max1234 vs The General!

Journeyman · Aug 20, 2003

I`ll pick a subject and two famous posters will battle it out each week.

They will make a case for their side and go head to head til we have a winner....I need TWO VOLUNTEERS

The subject we will debate is....

DOES PETE ROSE BELONG IN THE HALL OF FAME? I

We need one who is for and one who is against, can I get two volunteers?? Like all my creations this is a work in progress

Ok who wants in , who is a great debater? Now mind you its not who is RIGHT and WRONG its WHO PLEADS THE BEST CASE WILL BE THE WINNER!

[This message was edited by Journeyman on August 20, 2003 at 05:48 PM.]

TheGeneral+ · Aug 20, 2003

max1234 · Aug 20, 2003

Put me down, either side of anything... as long as it's not ID on the other side. I hate winning on the first post.

TheGeneral+ · Aug 20, 2003

Compared with some of the offenses professional athletes get charged with today, his seems kinda minor in comparison. I say let him in.

If we based hall of fame for character, then we would have a hall of shame. - Cochran

Journeyman · Aug 20, 2003

DING DING DING!!!

Okay we have Max vs The General

Max

will take the side that ROSE doesn`t belong in.

General will take his usual side

that Rose belongs in.

You boys will battle back and forth for the next few days til you beat yourselves silly and we decide who wins...Good Luck!

Remember the winner is the best debater , not who is right or wrong, now no hitting below the belt guys

max1234 · Aug 20, 2003

General,

Good luck... I won't be around for much longer but I figure this will be a couple of day ordeal battling someone of your considerable debating skills.

wilheim · Aug 20, 2003

Put me down on either side of anything. JMan when this debate is done you can use "Is Max really JJ Gold"? as the next subject. Max you have to take yes, in the debate.

wil.

Journeyman · Aug 20, 2003

Each week we will choose two volunteers, we will perhaps get a book to post a nice prize if our 'great debate`s' catch on...

max1234 · Aug 20, 2003

First of all, there's no way he should be in the Hall of Fame. He's an acknowledged sports bettor, among other things and was convicted and sentenced to several years in prison. None of the above, by itself, is reason enough to keep someone out of the HOF, but put them all together and it means ole Petey shouldn't go in.

Thrillseeker · Aug 20, 2003

Jman is saving DennisTheMan vs. BeantownJim as the pay-per-view main event!

Journeyman · Aug 20, 2003

Yes boys this debate will last as long as it takes to get a winner...should be 3-5 days maybe(given the limitations of being on site) after you boys knock it around for a few days we`ll decide who wins and advances!'

Wil, you can be in next weeks cage match...

TheGeneral+ · Aug 20, 2003

Should he be honored for his accomplishments? Absolutely. Did he gamble on baseball? More than likely. However, he has never admitted to it and the investigation conducted by the commissioner’s office was never officially concluded – meaning that there was never a ruling as to whether or not he bet on baseball.

max1234 · Aug 20, 2003

Wil,

A good debater should be able to argue either side. I'm not saying I think he should be in or out as a personal choice... I just like to argue. Mom always said I'd argue with a STOP sign. Sorry ole broad was right, I guess.

max1234 · Aug 20, 2003

I agree he should be honored for his accomplishments. No doubt about it. And he has been. Many times over. But the one thing that really bothers me, and you just alluded to it, is that he bet on baseball... and I believe he bet on his own team. I believe there is no way he takes that suspension from Giamontti (sp?) unless he knew his betting on BB would come out. This was his punishment for betting on BB and he fully believed Bart would lift the ban eventually. One problem, Bart croaked before he could lift it.

TheGeneral+ · Aug 20, 2003

Pete deserves to be in the Hall of Fame because of his contributions to the game.

most hits of all time

most singles (3,215)

at-bats (14,053)

games played (3,562).

He collected at least 100 hits in his first 23 seasons, another record.

He had more than 200 hits in a season 10 times, also a record

led the league in hits in seven seasons, and is the most prolific switch-hitter in history.

He is the only player to play 500 games at five different positions.

He was also an integral part of the Red’s domination in the 1970’s.

Pete truly loves the game. He played every game like it was the seventh game of the World Series.

Thus "Charlie Hustle”

TheGeneral+ · Aug 20, 2003

Giamati stiffed Pete and then died. That hurt.

There were standing ovations at World Series games and chants of ''Pete! Pete!'' at Cooperstown

The fans want him and thats the vote that matters.

max1234 · Aug 20, 2003

General,

No argument from me on his records... they speak for himself. He was one of the greatest hitters ever. And a good all around player. But to be in the Hall of Fame means you stood above the others, and put the game first. Pete put calling his bookie ahead of common sense. He knew the rules, probably better than 99% of the players. And one of the cardinal rules is no gambling on BB. Even if you bet on yourself to win. The Black Sox scandal gave BB a huge black eye. And I would assume the HOF rules were changed to make sure something like that never happened again. I've read excerpts where Bart G supposedly told people around him that Rose bet on BB. And if I remember correctly the bookies that were busted along with him said he bet on BB. If he would just come clean and admit it then I might have some sympathy for him. But at this point I have none. He broke the rules of BB and therefore must pay the price.

Journeyman · Aug 20, 2003

Did Rose kill Abe Bartlett Giamatti???

Anyone else realize this, Eric Show (gave up record breaking hit to Rose) is also dead!

Giamatti DEAD!

Show DEAD!

Ray Fosse

Cobb DEAD!

Is this coincidence???

TheGeneral+ · Aug 20, 2003

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> But to be in the Hall of Fame means you stood above the others, and put the game first. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

If integrity and character makes a Hall of Famer then aren’t there others in the Hall that also shouldn’t really be there? Ironically the decision maker in the whole process is Bud Selig who has more integrity issues than Pete Rose does.

max1234 · Aug 20, 2003

I know there are a lot people that would like to see him in the HOF, no doubt about it. But there were a lot of people that thought OJ was innocent too. In this case public opinion doesn't really mean that much. Our whole society seems to have regressed into a "let's forgive and forget" type of thing. And I'm not saying that's bad but I don't think the rules of something as steeped in tradition and honor as the HOF should change on the whim of public sentiment.