, would you tell the newbee that wants to start betting offshore.
There are NO guarantees that you will get paid, no matter what book you play at, or whatever reputation they have. If you get paid all the time (if you win) consider yourself lucky.
That is something that a lot of people like to forget. Books stiff players all the time, in some form or another, plain and simple. These books are in places most people can't pronounce, let alone find on amap. If they don't want to pay there isn't a lot you can do about it except piss and moan on a forum and have 4-5 years worth of arguments and records with NOTHING to show for it but carpel tunnel.
Also on a side note...these so called "watchdog sites" most are in the pocket of the books, so they have hidden agendas at best. Most that "arbitrate" can easilly get a kickback from a bok to side with them. If a book stiffs someone for 25K, who is to say the "arbitrator" can't be bought off for 10K or even 5K, and a nice advertising package?
People can post years and years worth of seemingly verifiable and uncontradicted "evidence" and a "third party arbitor" can still find against the player for seemingly no reason.
Gambling on the game isn't the biggest gamble in betting offshore that is first and foremost. Once you understand that the rest is easy.
That is something that a lot of people like to forget. Books stiff players all the time, in some form or another, plain and simple. These books are in places most people can't pronounce, let alone find on amap. If they don't want to pay there isn't a lot you can do about it except piss and moan on a forum and have 4-5 years worth of arguments and records with NOTHING to show for it but carpel tunnel.
Also on a side note...these so called "watchdog sites" most are in the pocket of the books, so they have hidden agendas at best. Most that "arbitrate" can easilly get a kickback from a bok to side with them. If a book stiffs someone for 25K, who is to say the "arbitrator" can't be bought off for 10K or even 5K, and a nice advertising package?
People can post years and years worth of seemingly verifiable and uncontradicted "evidence" and a "third party arbitor" can still find against the player for seemingly no reason.
Gambling on the game isn't the biggest gamble in betting offshore that is first and foremost. Once you understand that the rest is easy.
No doubt about it the posters are what make the forums what they are...not the owners , owners should be the last one to say this is a great place to play...
I would rather ask a restaurants customers how the food taste over the owner...logic
With 1000's of members here at The Rx, you will find the information needed on just about any aspect of any known book.
I would rather ask a restaurants customers how the food taste over the owner...logic
With 1000's of members here at The Rx, you will find the information needed on just about any aspect of any known book.
Journeyman said:
For the record, I wasn't really referring to therx as I feel this site has a great group of advertisers outside of MyBookie.
But even here, first hand experience from posters is far more valuable and accurate than just blindly clicking on a banner and hoping for the best. Each book has offers and caters to certain types of players. The newbie should read the experiences and offers and find a book that best suits their betting style.
Forums are full of aganeda driven posters, not to mention ghosts and schills. All forums are pretty much a place for degenrates to come in and act like they know what they are talking about, or simply to waste some time.
I have done my fair share of posting in the past, but for the most part it was wasted time.
As for forums really helping. Not usually. Most "newbies" are not looking for forums, they are looking to bet, by the time they find a place like this they have more than likely been screwed. That is the catch, they already are tainted when they start posting.
But sometimes a forum might get a guy a few hundred bucks, but thwne was the last time any serious money was gotten ina dispute that was settled by a forum? Hell Shrink got screwed out of tens of thousands, whether that was (advertising or winnings is debateable) and he OWNED this place, and was the best extortionist ever. So what can really be done for some screen name?
If the books do not want to pay, the don't have to, it is plain and simple.
If Pinnacle closed their doors tomorrow what could be done? If they took all the post ups they had in their accounts, and let the credit accounts slide, and pocketed a few million, you think the owners would care how much people bad mouthed them? Look at the most infamous guys who stiffed players out of millions, all are walking around, and most have even started other books, or are working for some other place.
So honestly, it is a pipe dream to think anyone can make a difference. It is by sheer grace people get paid at all.
Jay C is the only book owner/principle that I know of that has ever been prosecuted (convicted), and that surely wasn't for not playing players.
Look at the list of stiff books and the list of stiff owners, and show me ONE that has been hurt by stealing from people when they closed shop.
The sooner people know that they are pretty much helpless the better off they will be. It is borderline illegal to gamble on the net as it is, to think that a person has any recourse other than threatening "exposing" the book is hallucinating. Soa few hundred people see that a book stiffs a guy, there are a million other guys who don't read the forums that post up there all the time.
Forums have very little influence. They are more or less a convenience for the guys posting, and used as the owners to show a certain amount of traffic so they can use that as evidence of volume and charge more for advertising. The more hits a site gets, the more money they can charge for advertising, or them ore advertisers they can get.
Someone mentioned Covers, I have to sday I was a charter member of that forum, and watched it skyrocket, and change just like all the others. That site has been around since 96-97 I think, they had 6-7 updates until 2001 (when the forum started) after the forum got up and took off they updated the place seemingly 2 times a month. They got many more advertisers and most likely higher fees. Do you really think the number of people that used that site rose that much in that short a time? Not liklely, they just had more hits for guys using the forum as a chat room. But they surely did improve their stats and data bases. So a great by product came from it.
But now that the site has turned to schills and touts they basically advertise the low end books and books that cater to the losers. Their contests have become worthless, and they aren't offering the stuff they first did when the boom was on.
Why do you think Shrink wanted everyone to start posting at his new place? Traffic, plain and simple.
Also on another sidenote. There are enough forums out there now so that EVERY book has an outlet to advertise. It is seen on here constantly. Majors place might be ragging on a book, but on here that book might be the second coming, and vice versa. So newbies looking to get a REAL answer are lost. Major might say it is an A+ book, while here they might be a D-. All depends on what place is getting their advertising dollars. So anyone that is truly looking for advice is not going to get the real answers they need.
The only real answer is play whereever and hope you get paid. And if you are lucky enough to win in the first place, and then collect it all, you are further ahead than most.
I have done my fair share of posting in the past, but for the most part it was wasted time.
As for forums really helping. Not usually. Most "newbies" are not looking for forums, they are looking to bet, by the time they find a place like this they have more than likely been screwed. That is the catch, they already are tainted when they start posting.
But sometimes a forum might get a guy a few hundred bucks, but thwne was the last time any serious money was gotten ina dispute that was settled by a forum? Hell Shrink got screwed out of tens of thousands, whether that was (advertising or winnings is debateable) and he OWNED this place, and was the best extortionist ever. So what can really be done for some screen name?
If the books do not want to pay, the don't have to, it is plain and simple.
If Pinnacle closed their doors tomorrow what could be done? If they took all the post ups they had in their accounts, and let the credit accounts slide, and pocketed a few million, you think the owners would care how much people bad mouthed them? Look at the most infamous guys who stiffed players out of millions, all are walking around, and most have even started other books, or are working for some other place.
So honestly, it is a pipe dream to think anyone can make a difference. It is by sheer grace people get paid at all.
Jay C is the only book owner/principle that I know of that has ever been prosecuted (convicted), and that surely wasn't for not playing players.
Look at the list of stiff books and the list of stiff owners, and show me ONE that has been hurt by stealing from people when they closed shop.
The sooner people know that they are pretty much helpless the better off they will be. It is borderline illegal to gamble on the net as it is, to think that a person has any recourse other than threatening "exposing" the book is hallucinating. Soa few hundred people see that a book stiffs a guy, there are a million other guys who don't read the forums that post up there all the time.
Forums have very little influence. They are more or less a convenience for the guys posting, and used as the owners to show a certain amount of traffic so they can use that as evidence of volume and charge more for advertising. The more hits a site gets, the more money they can charge for advertising, or them ore advertisers they can get.
Someone mentioned Covers, I have to sday I was a charter member of that forum, and watched it skyrocket, and change just like all the others. That site has been around since 96-97 I think, they had 6-7 updates until 2001 (when the forum started) after the forum got up and took off they updated the place seemingly 2 times a month. They got many more advertisers and most likely higher fees. Do you really think the number of people that used that site rose that much in that short a time? Not liklely, they just had more hits for guys using the forum as a chat room. But they surely did improve their stats and data bases. So a great by product came from it.
But now that the site has turned to schills and touts they basically advertise the low end books and books that cater to the losers. Their contests have become worthless, and they aren't offering the stuff they first did when the boom was on.
Why do you think Shrink wanted everyone to start posting at his new place? Traffic, plain and simple.
Also on another sidenote. There are enough forums out there now so that EVERY book has an outlet to advertise. It is seen on here constantly. Majors place might be ragging on a book, but on here that book might be the second coming, and vice versa. So newbies looking to get a REAL answer are lost. Major might say it is an A+ book, while here they might be a D-. All depends on what place is getting their advertising dollars. So anyone that is truly looking for advice is not going to get the real answers they need.
The only real answer is play whereever and hope you get paid. And if you are lucky enough to win in the first place, and then collect it all, you are further ahead than most.
Dante said:
I agree...
I just meant as a watchdog site, they have a great group of advertisers (except MyBookie) so I wasn't taking a shot at the owner of this site. But there are other "watchdog" sites that will take anyone as an advertiser and send newbies to books like Royal and BetUS.
Posters here are great about giving their opinions and experiences. A newbie can do a search here and find all they need about most books.
