Cubs "ink" Jacques Jones.....

bucsfan67 · Dec 20, 2005

This may officially spell the end of Corey Patterson in Chicago......A shame that a young man with all this talent just hasnt been able to put it together, and take advantage of all his tools.....Jones will provide a solid hitter, and excellent defense for the cubs......good move IMO....

Cubs agree to terms with outfielder Jacque JonesESPN.com news services

MINNEAPOLIS -- Minnesota Twins right fielder Jacque Jones declined arbitration with the club, then agreed to a deal to play for the Chicago Cubs on Tuesday.

Jones' agent, Dan Lozano, said the Twins were only offering a one-year deal and that his client has several multi-year offers on the table. Jones accepted a deal with the Cubs for three years, but financial terms were not disclosed.
The Twins offered arbitration so they would be assured a 2006 first-round draft pick when the 30-year-old outfielder signed with another team. Jones made $5 million last season, but almost assuredly would have received a raise had he accepted the offer.
Jones was drafted by the Twins in 1996 and broke into the majors in 1999. He led the team with 23 home runs last season and hit .249 with 73 RBI.

viking611 · Dec 20, 2005

Jones is the exact same player they had in Burnitz.

Cubsmac · Dec 20, 2005

Solid defensive OFer, but doesnt solve the Cubs lineup problem. Just adds to it with another guy with a poor OBP and too many K's.

D2bets · Dec 20, 2005

viking611 said:
Jones is the exact same player they had in Burnitz.

Well, no. Jones is a much better defender and baserunner, and is younger. At the plate they are somewhat similar, though I think Jones has much more upside at this point. He should benefit from hitting away from the funeral home known as the Metrodome -- his career avg is 18 points higher on the road + higher power numbers. Whereas Burnitz's numbers were inflated from playing many years at Coors, Jones' numbers are deflated from playing at the Metrodome.

A modest upgrade over Burnitz.

blueedwards · Dec 20, 2005

best move the cubs made is losing nomar. he was paid like $250,000 per rbi last year.

D2bets · Dec 20, 2005

blue edwards said:
best move the cubs made is losing nomar. he was paid like $250,000 per rbi last year.

Watch him hit like .340 for LA now. But in any case they had nowehere to put him. His best position now is probably 3B but the Cubs already have one of those. Nomar in the outfield is a frightening proposition.

I would still like the Cubs to make a deal for a good middle infielder, but I don't think it's going to happen.

blueedwards · Dec 20, 2005

looks like the dodgers are trying to be the 2005 yankees...lofton and nomar? when is the robbie alomar and mo vaughn signing?

D2bets · Dec 20, 2005

Blue, what do you think of Jacque?

I think it's s pretty safe signing with some good upside. He isn't going to hurt you with his defense and baserunning. And he'll hit for some power at Wrigley. He was one of the integral players on some successful Twins teams.

blueedwards · Dec 20, 2005

D2bets said:
Blue, what do you think of Jacque?

I think it's s pretty safe signing with some good upside. He isn't going to hurt you with his defense and baserunning. And he'll hit for some power at Wrigley. He was one of the integral players on some successful Twins teams.

well, because you have pierre and have now signed jones...patterson has to be on the outs. that can't hurt. actually, losing nomar and patterson...you just may win it all this year.

but seriously folks, jones is good but, as someone else pointed out...another guy with decent power but very low on base %. pierre will definately get on base but, after lee and ramirez, that lineup is full of holes.

need more to compete with st. louis.

viking611 · Dec 21, 2005

D2bets said:
Well, no. Jones is a much better defender and baserunner, and is younger. At the plate they are somewhat similar, though I think Jones has much more upside at this point. He should benefit from hitting away from the funeral home known as the Metrodome -- his career avg is 18 points higher on the road + higher power numbers. Whereas Burnitz's numbers were inflated from playing many years at Coors, Jones' numbers are deflated from playing at the Metrodome.

A modest upgrade over Burnitz.

Burnitz hits more HRs, more RBIs, and higher avg. they both strike out the same, and Jones is not a base stealer. Very comparable in the OF as well but Jones may have stronger arm now. They are essentially the same player...both lefty batters as well. You did point out that Jones is younger so maybe that is a plus and where it might be a modest upgrade. Also Burnitz only played ONE season in Coors, not many!

D2bets · Dec 21, 2005

viking611 said:
Burnitz hits more HRs, more RBIs, and higher avg. they both strike out the same, and Jones is not a base stealer. Very comparable in the OF as well but Jones may have stronger arm now. They are essentially the same player...both lefty batters as well. You did point out that Jones is younger so maybe that is a plus and where it might be a modest upgrade. Also Burnitz only played ONE season in Coors, not many!

Burnitz is not a better avg hitter, He's a .255 career hitter. Jones' career avg away from the Dome is .288 where he has also hit 60% of his HR's. Not a single facet of the game that Burnitz is better at. I'd be surprised if anyone gives Burnitz more than 2mil for 1 yr. He's just about done.

TonyMar · Dec 21, 2005

Burnitz was due 7million. Jones got a 300,000 dollar raise with this deal at 5.3million.

Check out Burnitz's TERRIFIC numbers from '02 and '03. They were real solid. :103631605

'02 .215 BA, 19 HRs, 54 RBI w/Mets
'03 .239 BA, 31 HRs, 77 RBI w/Mets/LA

Yes '04 was nice at Coors as his stats surged....then last year he forgot how to run the bases. Recall when he was picked off third? Tying run? and he was picked off third! :103631605

Many blunders LY.

Jones has some speed, and should see some pitches in that lineup, which is quite different from the Twins everyday 9.

TheRightWing · Dec 21, 2005

Jones is a very streaky batter but has some pop once in awhile,weak arm but decent in the field......

JimmyHoffa · Dec 21, 2005

blue edwards said:
looks like the dodgers are trying to be the 2005 yankees...lofton and nomar? when is the robbie alomar and mo vaughn signing?

Well they did sign Bengie "molases" Molina to ride the pine and get fatter. I'm sure they'd try to sign Mo Vaughn if they could get him out of the buffet line.

mson · Dec 21, 2005

Cubs are clueless! Jones is a good role player, Patterson will never be any good, period. Their white collar management does not know or understand baseball.

D2bets · Dec 21, 2005

mson said:
Cubs are clueless! Jones is a good role player, Patterson will never be any good, period. Their white collar management does not know or understand baseball.

Patterson is going to be 100% traded. As good as gone.

Not sure what you mean by role player. He's always been pretty much a full-time starter, sitting against some lefties. No chance he accept being a reserve anywhere. Still got plenty of talent, let's see if it comes out.

viking611 · Dec 22, 2005

It's tough to figure sense of Jones deal
[SIZE=+1]Ex-Twin is little or no upgrade over Burnitz[/SIZE]
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</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>December 21, 2005

If there's any long-term benefit to signing Jacque Jones to a three-year contract, it's this: Down the road, maybe Felix Pie will have to earn his way onto the Cubs' roster. Corey Patterson had his job handed to him, and look at him now.

Sorry, but that's the closest I can come to a half-full glass after the Cubs "locked up" a non-All-Star whose career has been going downhill for at least two years.

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This is progress? Please excuse me while I scratch my head.

Jones was a good player on three playoff teams in Minnesota. He has crossed the threshold to age 30 without becoming a standout, however, ranking among the American League's top 10 only once in a major offensive category—ninth in strikeouts in 2002. In 2003, one of his best seasons, he hit .304 but blunted that contribution by somehow walking only 21 times while piling up 517 at-bats.

His batting average dropped 50 points the next season—equaling the drop that new Cubs center fielder Juan Pierre had from 2004 to '05—and continued dropping last season, though this time only by another five points. All this while playing half his games in the hermetically sealed Metrodome. Wait till he gets a full dose of Wrigley Field in April and May.

If Jones had been signed for one year, and maybe if the Cubs hadn't so pledged allegiance to Pierre after trading for him earlier this month, I perhaps would see him as a decent bridge to Pie. But the Cubs now have the homegrown Matt Murton in left field (the only outfield position he can play with confidence) and Pierre in center in addition to Jones, who is signed through 2008 at $5.33 million a year.

Pierre can be a free agent after next season, but general manager Jim Hendry went out of his way to express an interest in signing him long term after giving up rising prospect Ricky Nolasco and two other promising pitchers to get him. Assuming Pierre signs an extension, where's the 20-year-old Pie going to play when he's ready?

It could be the Cubs will change their mind and let Pierre walk. Or if Murton falters, they could move Jones to left and put Pie in right for the time being. The best-case scenario, if they keep Pierre, is for Pie to come on so strong they can trade Jones—or, more likely, Murton—to fill a need.

Or they could trade Pie in a package to land an impact player, hopefully one named Miguel Tejada.

I hope Pie isn't traded, in large part because I have seen him flash his five-tool talents and also because I have bought into what I have heard about him from folks in the Cubs' farm system.

Hendry talks about him as a Kenny Lofton-style leadoff man who will hit 10 to 20 homers a year. But Bobby Dickerson, who managed Pie at Double-A West Tenn last year, believes he could be a 30-homer man if he adjusted his approach and hit lower in the batting order.

"He loves to win," Dickerson said during the 2005 season. "That's the biggest thing I've seen. He really enjoys winning ballgames, and he always wins. Every team he has been on has made the playoffs, and three won championships."

Dickerson praises Pie's unselfishness.

"Everybody who plays the game wants to win, but he thrives on it," Dickerson said. "A lot of players go 0-for-4, their team wins and there's not really any jubilation. He's the type of guy that when he goes 0-for-4, [if] the team wins, he's happy.

"I remember one time this year we had won six in a row. He's walking off the field going, 'My team! My team! My team is great!' He just enjoys being part of something special, and it [becomes contagious] around him."

It's easy for me to say the Cubs need to remain patient with Pie, giving him another full year in the minor leagues. That's where a Pierre rental or a one-year contract with a right fielder would have seemed to be the ideal fit.

But looking at the Cubs' roster as it stands now, how patient can Hendry be?

They figure to make changes at four spots in the lineup from 2005. Pierre will be a major upgrade over Patterson in center field. Murton, who replaces Todd Hollandsworth as the primary left fielder, should be an upgrade but comes with no guarantees.

The Ronny Cedeno-Neifi Perez combination at shortstop does seem an improvement from the Nomar Garciaparra-Perez-Cedeno mix in 2004. And—here's the bad news—Jones figures to be about a wash with Jeromy Burnitz in right.

They finished with identical on-base-plus-slugging-percentage numbers in 2005: a very ordinary .757. The year before, Burnitz was a lot better, .915 to Jones' .742.

Burnitz was an above-average fielder but showed his age late in the season, going through the worst slump of his career.

But the Cubs are treating Jones like he's in a different class altogether, giving up their fourth-round draft pick in addition to the three-year commitment. That seems like a stretch.

Jones is a complementary player, the kind who can be valuable if he is surrounded by above-average hitters. The Cubs have two in Derrek Lee and Aramis Ramirez. Jones would look better if they had three—and the third was an elite hitter who played shortstop, like Tejada.

Think an offer of Carlos Zambrano, Pie and Perez would get the Baltimore Orioles' attention?

I do. The Cubs ought to be willing to give up Zambrano to get Tejada, especially if they still can add a free-agent starter (Kevin Millwood, Jeff Weaver or Brett Tomko would do).

I would hate to see Pie traded, but if he could help bring Tejada, that could excuse it, especially if the argument next September is which member of a Cubs playoff team most deserves the National League MVP, Lee or Tejada?

progers@tribune.com

D2bets · Dec 22, 2005

Phil Rogers is a goof. And calling Murton homegrown is kinda funny considering he was traded to the Cubs and spent barely a half season in their minors. Trading Zambrano and Pie for Tejada is lunacy.

Cubs "ink" Jacques Jones.....

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