War On Illegal Betting Begins

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Rx. Senior
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So the US Government has finally got around to cleaning up the game, something that was probably on the agenda some 12 Years ago. To understand whats going on you have to look at the bigger picture of internet Gambling and what has happened in other Countries especially Britain, America's best Friend. In Britain a number of legitimate Bookmakers went Off-shore with the Biggest ones, Ladbrokes and William Hill threatening the same, their argument at the time was that they were being squeezed by excessive taxes and duties charged on Horse racing. It has to be remembered that The Government were already in a position of earning Millions from the Industry so immediate action had to follow. Because the bookmakers were all licensed, this came down more to a negotiation of what was considered reasonable payments for doing business but the government left no doubt that without a deal, they would make Off-shore betting illegal and stamp it out. So in the end everyone got what they wanted and lived happily ever after, because the Carib Books take up so little of the British market its deemed not worth the effort chasing them.

Over the Years the US has struggled with the problem of illegal Gambling because its hasnt had a definite aim so has used the immoral card to keep it at bay. Theres no doubt that they would have talked to British counterparts about legalising it, after all its the Millions in Taxes their after. Because of its legality in Britain, the top people in the Industry are never far from influential Politicians who together keep their fingers on the Pulse. As for the Off-Shore books in the Carib, these are considered lowlife that have no part of the Future no matter who they are or what they say. The US Government will not do a U-Turn and legitimise previous Criminals so the options are very few.

What The US Government want is a Bone-fide company or Companies that are experienced in the Business, are beyond reproach in their dealings and big enough to run Sports Betting for them. That way it will be seen as no more evil than a National Lottery, they'll be no Criminal undertones or stories of People getting their Money stolen. That is why the Big British Books do not service US citizens at the Moment, to do so would be an illegal act and jepordise their chances of being at the Table.

Betfair has just recently finished a similar negotiation in Australia and would from all angles be the perfect vehical for the Government. A Publicly listed Company operating across the World, offering prices on all Sports at odds not considered a rip-off and plenty of Revenue for the Coffers. I could be wrong but as usual, Money is at the bottom of all this but the Powers are smart enough to know it has to be done properly, which until recently has been the stumbling block. :drink:
 

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I'm not so sure about the US legitimizing the online gambling angle, not with the Christian Conservatives driving the GOP's family value agenda. :pucking:
 

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winbet said:
So the US Government has finally got around to cleaning up the game, something that was probably on the agenda some 12 Years ago. To understand whats going on you have to look at the bigger picture of internet Gambling and what has happened in other Countries especially Britain, America's best Friend. In Britain a number of legitimate Bookmakers went Off-shore with the Biggest ones, Ladbrokes and William Hill threatening the same, their argument at the time was that they were being squeezed by excessive taxes and duties charged on Horse racing. It has to be remembered that The Government were already in a position of earning Millions from the Industry so immediate action had to follow. Because the bookmakers were all licensed, this came down more to a negotiation of what was considered reasonable payments for doing business but the government left no doubt that without a deal, they would make Off-shore betting illegal and stamp it out. So in the end everyone got what they wanted and lived happily ever after, because the Carib Books take up so little of the British market its deemed not worth the effort chasing them.

Over the Years the US has struggled with the problem of illegal Gambling because its hasnt had a definite aim so has used the immoral card to keep it at bay. Theres no doubt that they would have talked to British counterparts about legalising it, after all its the Millions in Taxes their after. Because of its legality in Britain, the top people in the Industry are never far from influential Politicians who together keep their fingers on the Pulse. As for the Off-Shore books in the Carib, these are considered lowlife that have no part of the Future no matter who they are or what they say. The US Government will not do a U-Turn and legitimise previous Criminals so the options are very few.

What The US Government want is a Bone-fide company or Companies that are experienced in the Business, are beyond reproach in their dealings and big enough to run Sports Betting for them. That way it will be seen as no more evil than a National Lottery, they'll be no Criminal undertones or stories of People getting their Money stolen. That is why the Big British Books do not service US citizens at the Moment, to do so would be an illegal act and jepordise their chances of being at the Table.

Betfair has just recently finished a similar negotiation in Australia and would from all angles be the perfect vehical for the Government. A Publicly listed Company operating across the World, offering prices on all Sports at odds not considered a rip-off and plenty of Revenue for the Coffers. I could be wrong but as usual, Money is at the bottom of all this but the Powers are smart enough to know it has to be done properly, which until recently has been the stumbling block. :drink:

Maybe someone that has lived in both the US and Britain has a clearer picture than I do of the 2 countries. But I think the biggest difference is that in the US, the religious people exert more influence than they do in England. In the US they even have their own television programs (Pat Robertson, etc). Is it like that in the UK?
This fact itself makes gambling much more accepted there. Just look at this country. Basically the US has said Nevada is where you can go if you want to gamble. Yes, I know it has branched out with the lottery and horse racing plus the Indian casinos. But this is a far cry from full speed ahead like in the Silver State.
But I like what winbet says and hope you are correct.
 

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Good post winbet but, as someone who has lived in the UK and the US whoson 1st is right, the US has a different moral posture.

I was shocked, shocked to find a what is called a Euro bathing pool at Wynn Las Vegas (which means women can go topless).

UK has always had a different posture to gambling. Prior to legalization of street corner shops I'm sure you know the situation going back 40 years. Betting was legal at the track and turf accountants could take telephone bets for their clients with accounts, but a bet with Joe on the street was illegal. Soccer betting was limited to pools, which a good part of the population religously mailed in every week, and there were even collection agents. A similar situation still exists I believe with gambling clubs for roulette and blackjack. Members can join, the activity is legal, but no advertizing is allowed. So the degenerates are tolerated but not encouraged. Maybe that will change when (if) a Vegas style casino opens up in Blackpool.

So the UK view has always been to tolerate and allow gambling under certain conditions whereas the US view has been to stamp out an evil vice. Gambling is a States issue and Nevada legalized gambling in the 1930's. New Jersey wanted to revitalize Atlantic City and Congress got fooled by the Indian Gaming Act since most of the members thought they were legalizing only Bingo. A good part of the opposition wants to totally eliminate gambling whereas others want to protect their turf, Las Vegas, Indians casinos, horse racing, State lotteries which is why gambling in the US is simply a mess of vested interests. Since internet gambling is offshore there is no vested interest inside the US and it has no voice, except through executives like David Carruthers who are vainly trying to promote regulation.
 
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" I was shocked, shocked to find a what is called a Euro bathing pool at Wynn Las Vegas (which means women can go topless). "

More details please!
 

Vici@us Desires
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I Think this so called War on illegal gaming is going to still being the same for many years.

USA GOV, they just want part of the action, or get the guys they couldnt the first time, thats all.

No more
 

Rx. Senior
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Money talks and as long as theres no sleaze or grubby Mitts, its a Racing certainty. The Coconuts are starting to get hairy, batten down the hatches.:drink:
 

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festeringZit said:
" I was shocked, shocked to find a what is called a Euro bathing pool at Wynn Las Vegas (which means women can go topless). "

More details please!

What part of topless sunbathing do you not understand?

BTW you need a room key to get into the pool area and it was cool in early April when I was there, so there were no special sights.
 

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Just walk down the beach in Miami between 1st and 15th st. You'll see more uncovered boobs than at the Playboy mansion.

-Sean
 

Rx. Senior
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Nearly Two years on and zero movement:sad3: Looks like I was wrong for once. :ohno: :drink:
 

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amazing how the religious right dont go after the churches that run bingo or vegas nights. Also why arent they using their movement to get rid of the casinos, racetracks and lotteries in this country?
 

I'll be in the Bar..With my head on the Bar
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amazing how the religious right dont go after the churches that run bingo or vegas nights. Also why arent they using their movement to get rid of the casinos, racetracks and lotteries in this country?

Ill tell you why, because they have had next to NOTHING with having the current laws passed..Sportsbetting anywhere but Vegas has been illegal since 1960 and the justice dept continues to this day to indict people based on that 1960 law...
Please show me where any preacher has ever organized any kind of protest against offshore gambling. Show me where Pat Robinson met with GWB in 1996 and proposed the UIGEA...Im pretty sure you wont find it.
Money does drive everything but Winbet had it wrong 2 years ago..The govt doesnt care about tax income if they did marijuana would have been legalized years ago. What they care about is donations to their own campaigns and under the table payoffs..Politicians always have 1 goal, Keeping their jobs and making sure they have enough money to defeat anybody who runs against them. They dont give a FUCK about tax revenues...Didnt you just hear Obama say he raising the taxes on 30 million Americans even if it meant increasing the national debt because HIS VOTER BASE (CAMPAIGN DONORS) WANTS HIM TO DO IT.. no other reason.
Sportsbetting is illegal because the offshores cannot line the pockets of politicians anywhere close to the size that Corporate Vegas, The professional sports leagues, and others can... Its going to stay this way for a very long time..
 

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Ill tell you why, because they have had next to NOTHING with having the current laws passed..Sportsbetting anywhere but Vegas has been illegal since 1960 and the justice dept continues to this day to indict people based on that 1960 law...
Please show me where any preacher has ever organized any kind of protest against offshore gambling. Show me where Pat Robinson met with GWB in 1996 and proposed the UIGEA...Im pretty sure you wont find it.
Money does drive everything but Winbet had it wrong 2 years ago..The govt doesnt care about tax income if they did marijuana would have been legalized years ago. What they care about is donations to their own campaigns and under the table payoffs..Politicians always have 1 goal, Keeping their jobs and making sure they have enough money to defeat anybody who runs against them. They dont give a FUCK about tax revenues...Didnt you just hear Obama say he raising the taxes on 30 million Americans even if it meant increasing the national debt because HIS VOTER BASE (CAMPAIGN DONORS) WANTS HIM TO DO IT.. no other reason.
Sportsbetting is illegal because the offshores cannot line the pockets of politicians anywhere close to the size that Corporate Vegas, The professional sports leagues, and others can... Its going to stay this way for a very long time..


What you said about being reelected and taxes is 100% accurate.
 

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Show me where Pat Robinson met with GWB in 1996 and proposed the UIGEA...Im pretty sure you wont find it.
quote]

First, thanks propokerplayer; I agree with many of your opinions regarding politicians generally. Second, I offer the following analysis from a legal perspective only. It's my fervent belief that this is the wrong board for personal political beliefs.

Having said that, I don't think it would be accurate to indict both parties equally for attacking the online gaming industry. Remember that the late night parliamentary deal that attached the UIGEA to the otherwise unrelated ports security bill was engineered mainly by four Republicans: then-Senate Majority Leader Bill Frist (R-Tenn), perrenial anti gaming legislation sponsor Senator John Kyl (R-Arizona), and the House anti gaming legislation co-sponsors Congressman Bob Goodlatte (R-VA) and then-Congressman Jim Leach (R-Iowa). At the time, Frist was eyeing a run for the presidency in '08, and attaching the UIGEA to the ports bill was seen by his staff as a way of gaining the inside track to Congressman Leach's (R-Iowa, don't forget) endorsement. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/UIGEA#Legislative_history

Earlier that fall, the UIGEA did come up for a vote by itself. The ugly results were that Republicans supported the bill by an overwhelming 201 to 17. Lest you celebrate too quickly if you're a Democrat, you should know that Democrats also supported the bill, albeit but by a much smaller margin, 115 to 76. http://clerk.house.gov/evs/2006/roll363.xml

Following the 'accidental' passage of the UIGEA (through a Robert's Rules quirk, the House had already adjourned and gone home before the UIGEA was even added), some Congressmen, led by Barney Frank (D-MA), sponsored a bill to retract the UIGEA provisions of the ports bill. To date, there are 47 co-sponsors, 43 Democrats, but only 4 Republicans. http://www.govtrack.us/congress/bill.xpd?bill=h110-2046

Last month, Frank and maverick (but likable) Republican Ron Paul co-sponsored a new bill, which would have the same effect as Frank's original bill. There are currently 12 co-sponsors to this bill; of these, 10 are Democrats and 2 are Republicans. http://www.opencongress.org/bill/110-h5767/show

Again, I take absolutely no position on political parties generally; I only wish to clarify the battle lines of the current legislative fight. I dislike the 115 Democrats who voted for the UIGEA as much as I dislike the 201 Republicans who did the same. But after reviewing the numbers, I don't think it's possible to honestly conclude that the two main parties are equally hostile to our industry. Though neither party can be said to be in favor of following Britain's model of regulation and taxation, certainly all the numbers seem to indicate that the Democrats appear to be of a more open mind to the idea.

Oh, yea, on the Pat Robertson thing, while I've never heard him comment on the UIGEA specifically, I suspect his views are predictable: "Like most evangelical and conservative Christians, Pat Robertson opposes gambling. He considers it a sin and has argued that people should actively refrain from engaging in it - in any form." http://atheism.about.com/library/FAQs/rr/blfaq_rr_robert_gambling.htm

Anyway, keep the faith, brothers. It's always darkest before the dawn.
 

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