Too many UNFOUNDED CONCERNS FOR these LL kids

Railbird · Aug 20, 2006

1.High Pitch count- Non issue, you going to brake a kids and teams heart because a kid has thrown 86 pitches through 5 innings, you going to take the ball out of his hand with his lifes defining moment on the line? BS Medical studies by administraters to JUSTIFY their OVERPAID JOBS is reason for this rule change, I dont care HOW MANY YES MEN, Thorne and Hershiser types there are.

2.Moving the Fences back 20 feet- Reason they did this is because record was broken last year. Why was it broken? Because last 2 years California, Curacao, and Japan had exceptional teams and exceptional hitters, coupled with week teams from great lakes and midwest. The move takes the excitement of the long ball out of the game.

3. Volunteer Umpires at regionals and Williamsport, these umps are controling the game and taking it away from the kids, see Pimental vs Florida last year. They hide behind the volunteer label for their ineptness, when the REALITY of it is their is 500 guys BEGGING to do the TV games. SOMEONE NEEDS TO HOLD these UMPS RESPONSIBLE. Thorne trying say Kyle Carter had an attitude was TOTAL BS. IT was the UMPIRE who had the TUDE.

4.

Dubpoet · Aug 20, 2006

Whats up in MTL? Are they going to serve?

Sportsrmylife · Aug 20, 2006

Fastballs don't hurt arms....curve balls do. Their arms aren't equipped for all that torque and when these teams make the Regionals and World Series these kids want to throw curves about 70% of the time since the batters aren't able to handle them.

I would only let my 15 year olds throw them on 0-2 or 1-2 counts and told them to spot the fastball and work on the change.

Why not pay the umps? How can you tell me that you can't pay these guys $50 a game. Take it out of the ticket or concessions stands. It isn't going to break the association.

whalewager · Aug 20, 2006

Curveballs can definitely hurt a kids arm. No doubt about it.

Railbird · Aug 20, 2006

Pitchers much more likely to get hurt if they DONT throw a curveball. YOu will have your knee cap or your skull busted from batters sitting on fastballs.

Sportsrmylife · Aug 20, 2006

Railbird said:
Pitchers much more likely to get hurt if they DONT throw a curveball. YOu will have your knee cap or your skull busted from batters sitting on fastballs.

A good change up with keep batters off balance enough. Mix in a curve for show on a 2 strike count. Why not just take the rocket launchers out of the game and then you won't have to worry about pitchers hurting their arms as hitting with wood with speed up the game, lessen pitch counts, and will help hitters learn HOW to hit.

whalewager · Aug 20, 2006

you can change speed without throwing a curve.

Rawpimple · Aug 20, 2006

Railbird you got a play on the LLWS today/tonight?

TTinCO · Aug 20, 2006

Sportsrmylife said:
Fastballs don't hurt arms....curve balls do.

Bingo-Nothing ruins a shoulder like throwing curveballs at a young age.

royalfan · Aug 20, 2006

Railbird said:
1.High Pitch count- Non issue, you going to brake a kids and teams heart because a kid has thrown 86 pitches through 5 innings, you going to take the ball out of his hand with his lifes defining moment on the line? BS Medical studies by administraters to JUSTIFY their OVERPAID JOBS is reason for this rule change, I dont care HOW MANY YES MEN, Thorne and Hershiser types there are.

2.Moving the Fences back 20 feet- Reason they did this is because record was broken last year. Why was it broken? Because last 2 years California, Curacao, and Japan had exceptional teams and exceptional hitters, coupled with week teams from great lakes and midwest. The move takes the excitement of the long ball out of the game.

3. Volunteer Umpires at regionals and Williamsport, these umps are controling the game and taking it away from the kids, see Pimental vs Florida last year. They hide behind the volunteer label for their ineptness, when the REALITY of it is their is 500 guys BEGGING to do the TV games. SOMEONE NEEDS TO HOLD these UMPS RESPONSIBLE. Thorne trying say Kyle Carter had an attitude was TOTAL BS. IT was the UMPIRE who had the TUDE.

4.

First point. I do agree on the pitch count thing. Managers responsibility to know how many is too many.

2nd point. Disagree completely as will most others. Still plenty of homers and it makes the game much better. Puts much more of a premium on having good outfield play which was not there in the past. Also puts a premium on positioning. Way better game now, no question about it.

3rd point. Kyle Carter should have been called out. He was laughing at the ump for crying out loud and showing him up. You think that is acceptable at the little league level?

4th point. Throwing curves will cause WAY more injuries than pitchers getting drilled by balls. Not even close.

Boxslayer · Aug 21, 2006

Sportsrmylife said:
Fastballs don't hurt arms....curve balls do.

On what planet? Don't get me wrong, I agree that curveballs are terrible for youngsters arms, but fastballs can hurt your arm, too. How? Fatigue. When you get tired, and your pitch count increases, you start throwing different to compensate for your fatigue. Most common case is elbow drop when the arm is in the cocked position. Great way to hurt a shoulder or elbow. I could go on forever about arm injuries due to fatigue.

High pitch count rule is more important than any Little League game. The worst thing for Little League is over-competitive parents, ruining their players potential careers over a stupid Little League game. And people wonder why pitcher's arm injuries are at a STAGGERING all-time high. A manager is usually a dad, and may not be trained well enough to determine if his pitcher is tired. No kid is ever going to admit that they want to come out or that they are tired. Only that kid can listen to his body, and honestly, most arent mature enough yet anyway to understand that concept.

A lot of big leaguers, or even guys on scholarship in college are former players in these LLWS. There's no reason for a kid to be running around with Tommy John surgery at 13 years old or a torn labrum or rotator cuff.

They shouldn't be throwing curveballs at age 13, either. Thats the most ridiculous thing I've ever heard. Maybe because I had Tommy John at 15 throwing too many curveballs. I dont see why 13 year olds should. Fastball/change is all you need at that age. Once you get to the LLWS, those pitchers throw so hard for those hitters, alot of players strike out, just getting fastballs blown by them. They should allow 1 curveball per hitter or some shit. You could get a monkey to go out there and throw 100 curveballs to Little Leaguers and have them swing over the top of it everytime and win games. But thats stupid and the kids arm will fall off.

Even in instructional ball in the Majors, most teams dont allow a pitcher to throw any breaking balls for the first few bullpens and outings. They want you to get back into it, and also to learn to pitch with your fastball.

Learning to pitch with your fastball is the most important thing for any pitcher. If you can't pitch with your fastball you have no future in baseball.

Railbird · Aug 21, 2006

Moving the fences back is lame, now we have a bunch of 1-0 bore fests. Also instead of having 6 or 7 kids that can hit a dinger you might have 1 if any. Calabrese for NY got every bit of that ball in the bot 6th and was a warning track ball.

royalfan · Aug 21, 2006

Railbird said:
Moving the fences back is lame, now we have a bunch of 1-0 bore fests. Also instead of having 6 or 7 kids that can hit a dinger you might have 1 if any. Calabrese for NY got every bit of that ball in the bot 6th and was a warning track ball.

Got every bit of that ball? Not sure what game you were watching. It was off the end of the bat. Wouldn't have even been gone on the old fences.

Sportsrmylife · Aug 21, 2006

The problem with pitching in Little League is that you get uninformed coaches telling their pitchers to "push off the rubber" when they should be teaching them to "fall toward home". These kids legs aren't strong enough at such a young age to use them the way a pitcher should.

Now the pitch count is good in principle but here is what I would do as an opposing coach. If the guy is throwing gas I would tell my players to take 2 strikes. Let's say the pitch count is 75 pitches. Ok each one of my batters sees an average of 5 pitches and even if we don't get a runner on that is 15 pitches an inning. That means he has to come out of the game around the 5th inning. They need to use another pitcher. Now if the pitcher is struggling you may have to use more pitchers. How many teams have a staff of 5 pitchers to work on a pitching count.

Boxslayer · Aug 21, 2006

Sportsrmylife said:
The problem with pitching in Little League is that you get uninformed coaches telling their pitchers to "push off the rubber" when they should be teaching them to "fall toward home". These kids legs aren't strong enough at such a young age to use them the way a pitcher should.

Now the pitch count is good in principle but here is what I would do as an opposing coach. If the guy is throwing gas I would tell my players to take 2 strikes. Let's say the pitch count is 75 pitches. Ok each one of my batters sees an average of 5 pitches and even if we don't get a runner on that is 15 pitches an inning. That means he has to come out of the game around the 5th inning. They need to use another pitcher. Now if the pitcher is struggling you may have to use more pitchers. How many teams have a staff of 5 pitchers to work on a pitching count.

Geez, people are still teaching push off the rubber? How about drop and drive? Thats always a personal favorite.

As for that hitting approach, we're just getting into coaching techniques and strategy now. Everyone plays it different. Though for the sake of discussion, I will say I disagree with that approach. Taking pitches is also a very old myth, similiar to push off the rubber, that really only works at the Little League level in certain situations, other than 3-0 counts. Taking 2 strikes is just a poor plate approach. If a ball is a cockshot and a strike, there should be a good cut made on that pitch, it shouldnt be left to just go by. Forcing all of your hitters to hit with 2 strikes on them, especially vs. pitchers that are so dominant and throwing too fast for them, they need every opportunity to get that bat off of their shoulder, take some cuts and get some timing down. Not to even mention their confidence levels should be terrible because they will be taking bad at-bats all game long, every game. Parents would be in your ear about that their sons shouldnt be in a 2 strike hole every at-bat before they can start their at-bat. And once again, just another parent taking winning and losing a Little League game too seriously, trying to exploit rules, not letting the kids play, progress as players and get better.

I'd also say the pitch count for a 13 year old player can be around 90 pitches, especially if they arent throwing breaking balls. That gets him completing the 6th inning vs. coaches that do this strategy. Now you just have 1 inning to complete throwing the rest of your staff.

max1234 · Aug 21, 2006

08-20-2006, 03:25 PM </TD><TD class=thead style="FONT-WEIGHT: normal" align=right> #5 </TD></TR><TR vAlign=top><TD class=alt2 width=175>Railbird<SCRIPT type=text/javascript> vbmenu_register("postmenu_3107277", true); </SCRIPT>
RX Wizard

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<HR style="COLOR: #fdde82" SIZE=1>Pitchers much more likely to get hurt if they DONT throw a curveball. YOu will have your knee cap or your skull busted from batters sitting on fastballs.
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The dumb bastard never ceases to amaze me. He acts like he's an authority on pitching and teaching kids how to pitch in the past and now he acts like 12 yr olds throwing curveballs won't hurt their arms along with throwing a high number of pitches. And why does he feel that way? Because it f*cks up his handicapping.... what a piece of chit human being.

Railbird · Aug 21, 2006

would be like moving all mlb fences to 450 feet, including down the line. All because Mustache Danny and Carlos Pineada hit a few homers against Davenport Iowa.

Willie99 · Aug 21, 2006

Pitchers can throw junk pitches without "twisting" their arms. Every release should look the same, it's the grip that changes. Having said this, most kids are not taught proper mechanics and do hurt their arms.

Pitch count & rest are critical. I've seen so many coaches at so many levels ruin arms because of:

1) allowing way to many pitches
2) allowing too much junk without proper mechanics
3) overuse his best pitcher and simply kill the kids arm

Too many mangers in the game for their own ego.

PurplePeopleEater · Aug 21, 2006

RAIL----
moving the fences back was a good thing. in the past, pop-ups have left the yard and that is a joke.
more emphasis being put on the outfield and defense is a good thing. Now the players have to be better positioned to make plays b/c the outfield is deeper.
there is nothing wrong with that.

as for curveballs, simply changing speeds would do it. essentially, that is what a curve ball is anyhow!

Railbird · Aug 21, 2006

Moving the fences back has ruined Willaimsport, 1-0,1-0, 1-0 in 9 innings, 1-0, and another 1-0 final, and then another 1-0 in 8 innings. This is what it has become.

Too many UNFOUNDED CONCERNS FOR these LL kids

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