When Paypal choose to quit taking sportsbooks money, did everyone panic?

CHOPTALK · Oct 20, 2006

Did everyone think that the end of offshore betting as we know it was done?

I was not on the forums back then. Just curious what the forum talk was like when paypal made the announcement that they would no longer accept offshore money.

TheRX made a really bad business decision when they choose to only save post for a 3 year period. I would love to go back and read what people were posting about in 1995.

Sugarbear · Oct 20, 2006

I was not on the fourms either, but I have studied there history and YES they more than paniced. They were just fourm books back then and not even a fly on the map for many.

A brutal game of close these places before the end comes took place also.

2003 is by far the worst time period in there history. Several things mashed in on them at the same time with PP being last.

I could go for a while.

mj23 · Oct 20, 2006

CHOPTALK said:
Did everyone think that the end of offshore betting as we know it was done?

I was not on the forums back then. Just curious what the forum talk was like when paypal made the announcement that they would no longer accept offshore money.

TheRX made a really bad business decision when they choose to only save post for a 3 year period. I would love to go back and read what people were posting about in 1995.

Yea and i wish they could bring back BIG LOU!!

FairWarning · Oct 20, 2006

People panicked, but I felt it wasn't that big a deal. Most CC's still worked at the time. Actually my back card Fifth-Third Bank worked up to last Friday when the bill was signed. I rarely use Neteller because I have to wait three business days until the money is in my account.

I am confident the main books will find a way around this however.

Dante · Oct 20, 2006

I was on the forums then and I did not see or remember much panic over it

RobFunk · Oct 20, 2006

CHOPTALK said:
Did everyone think that the end of offshore betting as we know it was done?

I was not on the forums back then. Just curious what the forum talk was like when paypal made the announcement that they would no longer accept offshore money.

TheRX made a really bad business decision when they choose to only save post for a 3 year period. I would love to go back and read what people were posting about in 1995.

There was not a lot of panic because Western Union amoung other options were still very viable. Additionally, there was no government tie to PayPal's decision.

WVU · Oct 20, 2006

There was mild panic on the forums. We knew paypal's exiting left the market wide open and we also quickly knew that Neteller was filling the void. I remember there being some concern that paypal would give out our private information and financial activity to others including the Feds. At the time Neteller was small and inefficient so there was concern on whether they could handle the mass of activity. Neteller grew fairly easily into their new model.

Gargoyle · Oct 20, 2006

I was there back then too, and there was no panic. Back then a representative of paypal was on the forum (forgot his name), but it looked at the time that this was an industry they wanted to venture in. When they started getting alot of chargebacks they started restricting alot of accounts and then ebay was interested in acquiring them. When they pulled out, neteller was already a competing company, so most just jumped ship to neteller. I remember using paypal to fund a wagerstreet account. Like dante said, there wasn't a panic that i can remember.

Sugarbear · Oct 20, 2006

The panic ensued on the book side, not player per say. There were some dangerous games going on. Also it was more of what else will they take vs just straight paypal.

Also a lot of threads just like today went to funding and the like.

Brock Landers · Oct 20, 2006

it wasn’t a big deal in although it was a convenient thing, paypal also led to Neteller. Now there isn't a processor that i am aware of the caliber or Neteller left when they go away..<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com

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Slotech · Oct 20, 2006

It would be a mistake attempting to correlate Pay Pal to Neteller with regard to courier services to/from US/offshore gaming merchants.

Pay Pal's termination of services wasn't the result of current legislation.

And therein lies the current misnomer surrounding the future of similar services, in that, those believing "some other courier" will simply step-in and take over Neteller's void would be suspect to the same potential legal liability risks now placed upon Neteller by the US, non security of client's funds (an illicit rouge courier) and/or the inability to transfer funds with US financial institutions under current law...in short, as non-viable as Neteller.

The onus of efficient, safe and convenient fund transfers between the US gaming consumer has been placed upon those seeking their business...the International gaming merchants, of which no viable method to "replace" the pending termination of such services currently provided by Neteller has or may never be introduced.

For now, it is unreasonable to expect a response/alternative courier service proposal from International gaming merchants to "replace" Neteller services until wording of the US LAW has been completed...hence, the Limbo.

While "limbo" is a good platform to prepare the ultilization of alternatives.

buddyboy · Oct 20, 2006

if i remember correctly the concern was not that getting money back and forth from the books would come to an end... it was more of whether or not bettors would get their money from paypal b4 they shut down for good.

back then there were more ways to xfer money... someone asked in a different post how far back does this bill put back the industry? well going back in time would be a good thing as far as sending money goes.

Woody0 · Oct 20, 2006

The usual chicken types panicked and asked stupid questions like "Can I transfer my PayPal balance to NETeller".

According to my records I opened my NETeller account 4 months before PayPal left the market. It was then simply a matter of withdrawing from PayPal to my bank account and depositing to NETeller.

Today I think the major players are awaiting the enabling regulations. Once they are drafted and an implementation date set, the industry will be in a position to make informed decisions.

Akillies · Oct 20, 2006

I was already using netteller before paypal was not accepted at s/b's, and i still have $ in and use paypal as do alot of others.

WildBill · Oct 20, 2006

People suspected it was coming when EBay bought PP. It was sort of confirmation of expected bad news, but there was little panic because back then it was a really dynamic market. One provider didn't have more than a third of the market. With NT now there isn't much going on in the marketplace, most everyone just uses NT or bank wires.

sean1 · Oct 20, 2006

People were worried because people had heard of neteller but did not trust them.

When neteller first opened up, they had no security. You didn't need a birthdate, ssn, anything... You could basically have 20 neteller accounts in any names you wanted. This was all fine and dandy for making money, but a bit scary to leave much money with a company that seemed completely disorganized.

Paypal folded, neteller started making millions, they realized they had to get real names and ssns, etc to block money laundering and they grew.

if they fold, someone will step up.

Sean

sean1 · Oct 20, 2006

Also, securebuxx, prepaidatm, moneybookers, egold, swiftpay, etc all cropped up.

Moneybookers is probably second behind neteller. For the life of me, I can't figure out why you can only send $10,000 or so every 90 days. If they fixed this, they would be a perfect solution for the hundreds of millions of dollars neteller seems willing to cough up.

Sean

sean1 · Oct 20, 2006

There is nothing the banks have done to block neteller. Hence any other company who wanted to take a chance could step up. Think there are not people who take chances? Then there would be no bookies, no drug dealers, no escorts, etc.

Sean

wolfie_cr · Oct 20, 2006

Actually I dont think anybody 'panicked' it was most a 'awwwww shit' kind of thing

Paypal did not deal with egaming from the beginning, then they had a change of mind and gaming took off big big time, I remember the guy from paypal visiting Costa Rica and promoting his product, I think everyone in the industry knew that this was not going to last (At least I didnt think so)

it was rumored at the time that gaming was a big percentage of paypal's profits (hell you can make a lot more out of 1000 transfers for 1000 dollars each that out of a 100000 transfers of 5 bucks and less trouble anyway in terms of follow up etc)