Neteller's problem solved

Neteller should just go back to a paypal system where you send money to individuals. They already allow this. Why not just tell books, that they will not longer service "books" in January, but that anyone is welcome to a personal account.

The US can not expect foreign banks to monitor who may be gambling related if they are not signed up as a book...

Seems pretty simple to me and totally reasonable.

If the US says shut down, they just say, we only transfer money to individuals just like WU, paypal, and visa.
-Sean

And PayPal got sued for processing gaming payments (New York and Federal).

NETELLER's problem is that it is public. PayPal banned gaming as soon as Ebay (public company) bought them.


Books could indeed accept NETELLER payments as peer transfers, but if they do ban gaming they may not risk it. Nobody accepts PayPal anymore.

Adam Selene said:

And PayPal got sued for processing gaming payments (New York and Federal).

NETELLER's problem is that it is public. PayPal banned gaming as soon as Ebay (public company) bought them.


Books could indeed accept NETELLER payments as peer transfers, but if they do ban gaming they may not risk it. Nobody accepts PayPal anymore.

Click to expand...

But the PayPal transfers to books weren't peer to peer--the books all had PayPal merchant acounts like I do for my business. I see what the original poster is saying--basically, Neteller wouldn't do business with books any more. They'd just become a peer to peer money transfer system. That way they wouldn't pass judgement on what the money sent from one peer to another was used for. So if I wanted to send money to my brother to pay my half of mom's Xmas present, or if I wanted to send money to some guy in Costa Rica who just so happens to work for a sportsbook and will just so happen to deposit the proceeds into my wagering account its none of their business. That's pretty much the way PayPal works now--if I send my brother, or whomever, money PayPal doesn't care whether its for a donation to his church or for a kilo of blow. Actually they might *care* but they seem to have a "don't ask/don't tell" type policy at least for transfers between individuals....

It just might work--one problem that I see is that there would be a risk of fraud. Now if I send money to a business through PayPal (or Neteller) I know the business name I'm sending it to. Potentially, there could be a problem with spoofers saying that "I'm Joe Blow and I work for BetCRIS--if you want to post up send your dinero to me" and them not really having any affiliation with the book and just pocketing your loot.

Not a bad idea, assuming that the books could do something to insure that you're sending it to a legit contact without advertising what they're doing too blatantly....

Adam Selene said:

And PayPal got sued for processing gaming payments (New York and Federal).

Click to expand...

I don't think PayPal was ever sued. I believe the New York Attorney General sent a threatening letter and PayPal came to a large monetary settlement without admitting to any illegal act. I don't think there was any Federal action. If I am wrong please cite your source(s).

Paypal was processing payments to gambling operations - not people.

Western Union sends to people - they have had no problem.

Paypal was not sued - they were threatened by a smart prosecutor who likes money right when Ebay bought them and rather than have the questionable press, Ebay paid to make it go away.

Some books still accept paypal. They don't advertise it, but if you take 100 books and email them, 10-20 will give you an email address to use with paypal.

Sean

The key to good contacts would be to call in for the name... If you call the number on betcris's home page, you know you got betcris... If you get an email, who knows... This is how Western Union has been for years... Most books won't give you a name via email for this exact reason although a few will..

da1prophet said:

But the PayPal transfers to books weren't peer to peer--the books all had PayPal merchant acounts like I do for my business. I see what the original poster is saying--basically, Neteller wouldn't do business with books any more. They'd just become a peer to peer money transfer system.

Click to expand...

I do understand that, and he does have a point.

However, both Paypal and Neteller DO offer peer-to-peer transfers, always have AFAIK. When Paypal shut off gaming merchants, no major gaming merchants started accepting peer transfers via Paypal. I expect exactly the same with NETELLER.

NETELLER won't become peer-to-peer only, because they still have all the European/Asian gaming companies and offering them an integrated instaCash deposit method is too valuable.

There will, inevitably, be NETELLER like competitors, some of which may purely be peer-to-peer. Although honestly, peer-to-peer transfers present a much larger fraud and phishing problem that merchant-based systems.

Woody0 said:

I don't think PayPal was ever sued. I believe the New York Attorney General sent a threatening letter and PayPal came to a large monetary settlement without admitting to any illegal act. I don't think there was any Federal action. If I am wrong please cite your source(s).

Click to expand...

<< Under the settlement, PayPal will not process payments from New York customers to Internet casino websites as of September 1, 2002, and will pay $200,000 to New York State in disgorged profits, costs of investigation, and penalties. >>

Whether they settled a lawsuit or investigation that would have led to a lawsuit is rather immaterial. They were formally subpoena'd.

<< Earlier this week, the online payments company received a subpoena from the attorney general of New York asking the company for documents related to its processing of online gambling transactions, PayPal said Friday in a filing with the Securities and Exchange Commission. >>

It is worthy to note, however, that a court of law has never addressed the issue -- in every case I am aware of -- Citibank, Google, PayPal, etc, etc, all settled.

<< The U.S. Department of Justice and the online payment service, which is now owned by eBay, said late Thursday that they had entered into the settlement agreement. The government's claims, disclosed in March, asserted that PayPal had violated the USA Patriot Act and the Wire Wager Act. >>


http://www.oag.state.ny.us/press/2002/aug/aug21a_02.html
http://news.com.com/N.Y.+subpoenas+PayPal+over+gambling/2100-1017_3-943533.html
http://news.com.com/2100-1017_3-5055237.html