How Does Pinnacle Know You Are In The U.S.A.?

Number_9 · Jan 11, 2007

I'm too scared to mess around with my Pinnacle account until my (final?) withdrawal is processed, but I'd love to do some experimenting to see what exactly it takes to get my account reinstated.

(Just using Canada as an example)

What if you changed your address on file with them to a Canadian address?
What if you signed on from a Canadian computer?
What if you did both?
Do they know or care where your Neteller account is registered?
If you send a Cashier's Check, do they care where the bank is located? Or where you sent it from?

Now I know that if they wanted too, Pinnacle could ask for Canadian ID, a Canadian utility statement, and trace everyone's IP address. They could probably perfom some kind of verification on your Neteller account. They could choose to only accept Cashier's Checks issued from banks outside the US, and sent from outside the US.

But will they? I guess the heart of it is, is Pinnacle just trying to cover their ass here, or are they going to aggressively make sure that each and every bet from each and every customer has no attachment to the USA?

I would be interested to hear anyone's thoughts about this. Does anyone know the answers to any of these questions with 100% certainty? I would really love it if one of you could do some experimenting along these lines for the benefit of the rest of us.

:toast:

-#9

CalvinTy · Jan 11, 2007

Just to mention 1 thing as you bring up an interesting thought.... why involve Neteller or another intermediary when you could just do electronic check deposit with your "future Canadian bank" to/from Pinny? That's one less hurdle... of course, the main ones remain:

1.) Canadian physical address (there is a link in other room about this right now by Woody0; virtual address and/or using a mailbox service)
2.) Canadian bank account (xpanda already confirmed that several banks permit Americans to have Canadian bank account without being a resident)
3.) Create a new Pinny account using Canadian networking.... this step only needs to be done once (someone mentioned about Windows VPS; basically a virtual server that can connect to a Canadian ISP)

Then telling Pinnacle that you are a "Canadian resident but often wagering from within USA" so they don't flag your account; or better yet, just contine to use the virtual server to wager at Pinny.

A serious poster here can do all of the above, I do believe that. I just want to see someone showing success in doing so. Though, Pinny -104 juice is all worth that hassle, eh? I am not sure yet, LOL.

* CalvinTy

Brendanb438 · Jan 11, 2007

Calvin can you post a link to Woody's info? I couldn't find the thread you were talking about. Also Xpanda what Canadian banks will allow US citizens to open accounts, and can we open these online?

The ISP stuff is the easiest part to get around, whether a proxy server or just Dial Up to Canada. Like Calvin said if anyone has successfully pulled this off please post what all you used under a new account to give us some direction.

-Brendan

slapshot · Jan 11, 2007

http://forum.therx.com/showthread.php?t=446785

nimue77 · Jan 11, 2007

It wont work if pinny realy wants to stop americans from playing there. Don't you think they would know if they suddenly start getting all these new canadian accounts...plus your using your name....so all these people moved to canada? They can easily check that too. Mabye ifyou have someone in another country who can open an account and let you use it with a vpn on their computer.

soccerbob · Jan 11, 2007

Number9- I think there's probably several ways to get an account opened at Pinnacle. I hope some of the sharps in this forum can think of some ways.

A few months ago another chicken shit book out there stopped taking US customers and I found a way around that using some suggestions I got from this forum and a few other places. I won't mention the book but here's what I did. I went to their signup page and used my real name but then made up a Canadian address. Don't forget their different type of zip code. I used a non US based email address. There are several you can sign up for and they're free. They're used all over the world so you can't tell where the person is from by looking at the email address. I typed in a user name and password and sent it through. They sent a confirmation to that email address I used and then I funded the account with Neteller and everything has been fine so far with wagering, depositing and withdrawing.

Pinnacle is a dogshit outfit but I like the book a lot. My guess is it shouldn't be too hard to get an account opened there but let's hope there is some input from other posters out there about how to do it.

cdsmoney · Jan 11, 2007

I've actually considered some of the things mentioned above (have to travel to buffalo on business for the govt, so I'll be close to the border anyway). I might have an easier time, since I haven never opened an account with them.

My concern, of course, is the IP check. Does pinny do this now or plan to block all US IPs (not a computer wiz, but I believe it could be done)? It isn't that far-fetched that a 'traveling' canadian would place wagers across the border in the U.S.

Backdoorit · Jan 11, 2007

cdsmoney said:
I've actually considered some of the things mentioned above (have to travel to buffalo on business for the govt, so I'll be close to the border anyway). I might have an easier time, since I haven never opened an account with them.

My concern, of course, is the IP check. Does pinny do this now or plan to block all US IPs (not a computer wiz, but I believe it could be done)? It isn't that far-fetched that a 'traveling' canadian would place wagers across the border in the U.S.

They could quite easily block a range of US addresses but there are plenty of programs that will change your IP address and use one from another country so IP blocking would not be 100% successful

DarrylParsons · Jan 11, 2007

Number_9 said:
What if you changed your address on file with them to a Canadian address?

What if you signed on from a Canadian computer?

What if you did both?

Do they know or care where your Neteller account is registered?

If you send a Cashier's Check, do they care where the bank is located? Or where you sent it from?

.

:toast:

-#9

Excellent questions but I'm afraid I have to disappoint you with my recent experience.

I'm in the USA right now and got the same message as everyone else when I logged in. I've got my temporary US address registered with them, so I couldn't place any bets either. Since I'm a Canadian with Canadian ID, utility bills and an ISP from Canada, I thought I'd just change my address on my profile to Canada, use a dial up connection through my Canadian ISP (with long distance charges of course) and see if I could bet.

Somehow the buggers still knew I was logging in from the US and it wouldn't let me bet. The same goes for another online casino that banned US players a few weeks back.

Maybe I need to erase all my cookies and try opening a new account? Maybe I need to use a new computer? Or just replace the processor or whatever part gives out the identity information!? Any computer saavy people have some tips on this!?

Backdoorit · Jan 11, 2007

Most of the places just look at your IP address. Is the IP you are receiving a Canadian one or US?

cdsmoney · Jan 11, 2007

Darryl Parsons said:
Excellent questions but I'm afraid I have to disappoint you with my recent experience.

I'm in the USA right now and got the same message as everyone else when I logged in. I've got my temporary US address registered with them, so I couldn't place any bets either. Since I'm a Canadian with Canadian ID, utility bills and an ISP from Canada, I thought I'd just change my address on my profile to Canada, use a dial up connection through my Canadian ISP (with long distance charges of course) and see if I could bet.

Somehow the buggers still knew I was logging in from the US and it wouldn't let me bet. The same goes for another online casino that banned US players a few weeks back.

Maybe I need to erase all my cookies and try opening a new account? Maybe I need to use a new computer? Or just replace the processor or whatever part gives out the identity information!? Any computer saavy people have some tips on this!?

People have mentioned an "anonymizer" (masks the IP - again, not a techie here), but I'm sure you might get flagged for something like that also.

xpanda · Jan 11, 2007

Brendanb438 said:
Calvin can you post a link to Woody's info? I couldn't find the thread you were talking about. Also Xpanda what Canadian banks will allow US citizens to open accounts, and can we open these online?

Bank of Montreal, CIBC, and HSBC Canada all accept US customers. There may be more, but these are the ones I've currently verified.

Warning: HSBC will report interest earnings to the IRS.

Because all Canadian bank accounts are insured by the gov't, regulation requires that all accounts be opened in person to verify the identity of the account holder. You'll need two pieces of ID, including a Passport.

Hope that helps.

AdamSelene · Jan 11, 2007

xpanda said:
Warning: HSBC will report interest earnings to the IRS.

Open a non-interest-bearing account.

WildBill · Jan 11, 2007

xpanda said:
Bank of Montreal, CIBC, and HSBC Canada all accept US customers. There may be more, but these are the ones I've currently verified.

Warning: HSBC will report interest earnings to the IRS.

Because all Canadian bank accounts are insured by the gov't, regulation requires that all accounts be opened in person to verify the identity of the account holder. You'll need two pieces of ID, including a Passport.

Hope that helps.

Having a Canadian account doesn't make you a criminal. Not reporting your interest does. Nothing wrong with getting one of these accounts, just a lot of hassle. Just make sure you aren't going over any arbitrary transaction limits, have no idea what they are in Canada compared to the 10k in the US.

Salain · Jan 11, 2007

Hmm I somehow missed the bit about them requiring you to sign up in person.

Number_9 · Jan 11, 2007

Thanks guys. Any more thoughts?

ICALL · Jan 12, 2007

Anyone with any information on Bahamas or Cayman solution for us southern folk?

Its brutally cold up there in Canada right now. I can get to the Bahamas in 30 minutes. Anyone like xpanda with some Cayman or Bahamian knowledge for Banks?

I found one of the links xpanda posted offers mail/address service in Bahamas. Now I just need IP address and bank. Anyone?

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