Omar Vizquel... Hall of Fame or no?

themanej2001 · Jul 16, 2007

I think he gets in personally... If he can get to 3000 hits he is an absolute lock when you add his glove in there...

Has to be the greatest defensive SS in the game outside of Ozzie and a career 275 hitter..

What do you guys think...?

These HOF threads always get good conversations started...

Guys pretend I didn't start it haha.

VIEJODINOSAUR · Jul 16, 2007

No....3000 hits really doesn't cut it anymore...I say no without hesitation...

themanej2001 · Jul 16, 2007

VIEJO DINOSAUR said:
No....3000 hits really doesn't cut it anymore...I say no without hesitation...

Doesn't cut it anymore... let me know when a guy doesn't get in who has 3000 hits.

JohnnyB · Jul 16, 2007

Would have to see all his numbers to say for sure, but my initial reaction is no way. I think way too many people get into the hall nowadays...

JohnnyB · Jul 16, 2007

themanej2001 said:
Doesn't cut it anymore... let me know when a guy doesn't get in who has 3000 hits.

That doesn't mean he should.

themanej2001 · Jul 16, 2007

He is the second best defensive player at the most important defensive position on the field....

FairWarning · Jul 16, 2007

Quick, someone name the career-defining moment for Omar Vizquel.

VIEJODINOSAUR · Jul 16, 2007

themanej2001 said:
He is the second best defensive player at the most important defensive position on the field....

Name me the best and then name me other shortstops you rate Omar above...:discuss:

fhmesq44 · Jul 16, 2007

This was already extensively discussed in OMT's "Could Ozzie Smith Start" thread and Chop's "I count 174 locks for the baseball HOF" thread.

Should he get in, no, will he, unlikely.

JohnnyB · Jul 16, 2007

FairWarning said:
Quick, someone name the career-defining moment for Omar Vizquel.

Not sure if you're being serious or not, but if you are, getting 6 hits vs the Yankees when the Indians beat them 22-0.

prodigy · Jul 16, 2007

there are very few guys that i will passionately vouch for when it comes to online or weekend sports discussions.
but vizquel is one of them. an absolutely amazing shortstop whose numbers might not have always been representative of his greatness. of all the indians 1993- present, id honestly put him 2nd behind manny ramirez in terms of hall of fame worthiness. the caveat is that i am not concerning myself with numbers. i know guys like albert belle and kenny lofton have strong statistical resumes. but ramirez and vizquel are the only two ex-indians that i would be disappointed if they didnt make the hall of fame.

Journeyman · Jul 16, 2007

nope and he has no shot at 3000 which would get him in IMO.

3000 is automatic still in my book.

themanej2001 · Jul 16, 2007

VIEJO DINOSAUR said:
Name me the best and then name me other shortstops you rate Omar above...:discuss:

Ozzie Smith was the best...

I rate him above Trammel, Aparacio, Yount, and Belenger

FairWarning · Jul 16, 2007

Johnny B said:
Not sure if you're being serious or not, but if you are, getting 6 hits vs the Yankees when the Indians beat them 22-0.

I was serious. Rennie Stennett went 7-7 vs the Cubs back in 1975.

themanej2001 · Jul 16, 2007

Journeyman said:
nope and he has no shot at 3000 which would get him in IMO.

3000 is automatic still in my book.

Was hoping you would chime in... glad FHM chimed in as well as we usually agree on these... Maybe I am a little off on this...

But think he just deserves it...

Also you don't think he can get 400 more hits because I think he gets to 2600 by seasons end? I think he can stick around and make it

VIEJODINOSAUR · Jul 16, 2007

themanej2001 said:
Was hoping you would chime in... glad FHM chimed in as well as we usually agree on these... Maybe I am a little off on this...

But think he just deserves it...

Also you don't think he can get 400 more hits because I think he gets to 2600 by seasons end? I think he can stick around and make it

There is the rub, sticking around to make it...hate when ballplayers just stick around to reach a number...their careers shoud speak for themselves..

FairWarning · Jul 16, 2007

themanej2001 said:
Ozzie Smith was the best...

I rate him above Trammel, Aparacio, Yount, and Belenger

No way was he better than Aparacio. Aparacio was 2nd in MVP voting in '59. Aparacio was a bigger part of the White Sox teams than Vizquel was with Cleveland. Vizquel only made 3 All-Star teams. Vizquel only batted .208 in the WS. Trammell was the WS MVP and a big part of the Tigers. Won't even go into Yount's accomplishments.

I will rank your list for you:

Yount - HOF
Aparacio - HOF
Trammell - ahead of Vizquel because of his postseason success, but will fall a little short.
Vizquel - No
Belanger - No

YourAllAmerican · Jul 16, 2007

It's too bad there's no such thing as the "Hall of Very Good." That's where guys like Vizquel (and Rafael Palmeiro and Craig Biggio, among 3,000-hit players) belong.

Vizquel plays a fantastic shortstop and makes the team around him better, but he's not one of the greatest ever to play the game. He has never been one of those game-transforming players (like Ozzie Smith was; he changed the way shortstops played when he came along), but an excellent player.

The HOF has been cheapened by the inclusion of many, many borderline players, in my opinion. I'd like to see them open some sort of special wing, honoring only the greatest of the great. If they did that, you could make a case for the inclusion of more players like Omar Vizquel.

VIEJODINOSAUR · Jul 16, 2007

Vizquel is a great player and great defensive player, but when it comes down to HOF material, just a tad short....

themanej2001 · Jul 16, 2007

FairWarning said:
No way was he better than Aparacio. Aparacio was 2nd in MVP voting in '59. Aparacio was a bigger part of the White Sox teams than Vizquel was with Cleveland. Vizquel only made 3 All-Star teams. Vizquel only batted .208 in the WS. Trammell was the WS MVP and a big part of the Tigers. Won't even go into Yount's accomplishments.

I will rank your list for you:

Yount - HOF
Aparacio - HOF
Trammell - ahead of Vizquel because of his postseason success, but will fall a little short.
Vizquel - No
Belanger - No