Heard this yesterday on the NE game- offense wins in todays NFL

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Rx Wizard
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The announcer (I think it was Phil Simms) said this. I have been arguing that for years and have been a firm believer in it.

Now I know it is not as clear cut as saying either way, offense or defense wins but if you have a top notch QB (and not many do nowadays) than you usually should win more than you lose in todays NFL. It is the key to being successfull in today's NFL. Look how many bad QB's here are in todays game and if you dont get good play out of them than you have no chance or more importantly if you dont have a solid QB than your team isnt a serious contender.

Look how close the Bears were to not being a good team last year, everyone knew it. Now with a below average defense they suck overall. But very rarely does a team get good QB play and are a bad team.

I know some of the old school guys wont belive this but look at the top 3 yards per play teams in the NFL (Dallas, NE, Indy).

Not saying this guarantees anything but I think if you have a great offense in the NFL than you have a better chance to be special than if you have a great defense.
 

RX Senior
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The passing game wins the NFL

A good RB? Whats that?! Oh thats the guy that gets some yards when the defense is off gaurd.
 
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The announcer (I think it was Phil Simms) said this. I have been arguing that for years and have been a firm believer in it.

Now I know it is not as clear cut as saying either way, offense or defense wins but if you have a top notch QB (and not many do nowadays) than you usually should win more than you lose in todays NFL. It is the key to being successfull in today's NFL. Look how many bad QB's here are in todays game and if you dont get good play out of them than you have no chance or more importantly if you dont have a solid QB than your team isnt a serious contender.

Look how close the Bears were to not being a good team last year, everyone knew it. Now with a below average defense they suck overall. But very rarely does a team get good QB play and are a bad team.

I know some of the old school guys wont belive this but look at the top 3 yards per play teams in the NFL (Dallas, NE, Indy).

Not saying this guarantees anything but I think if you have a great offense in the NFL than you have a better chance to be special than if you have a great defense.

never realized that.
 
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in all seriousness, a competant coach/qb combo is good for at least 8 wins in this garbabge league. just look at tampa this year.
 

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having a great d keeps your offense on the field = time of possession, having a great qb keeps your offense on the field = time of possession. t.o.p is the common link imo.
 

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2 things here:
dominant defenses do not stay dominant for more than 2 years. Investing big money in defense is silly. Offenses take longer to gel and thus deserve bigger long term investments.

Teams are now following that study by the Harvard guy and going for it on 4th down a lot more, as they should. Pinning an opponent inside their own ten is worth more than three points in the NFL. Inside their own 20, on average, is worth about three points. In an industry where a home playoff game can be worth twenty million, it makes sense to maximize their potential points.

Coaches naturally eschew risky decisions in favor of "safe" decisions, but their acts are incongruous with winning and are aimed to deflecting media criticism against them. Notice how the media called Les Miles "ballsy" when he went for those first downs on fourth down. Whether he knew it or not, he made the correct percentage play. The only time it did not make sense, was the final one, where the reciprocal points were unlikely to result because of the lack of time remaining in the ballgame. Smart coaches are now coming into the league, and dumb coaches like Herman Edwards, Norv Turner, Lovie Smith, and Marvin Lewis are being phased out. Punters will continue to be used less (as they rightly should) in the future.
That's my take on the state of offense in the NFL, and where it is going.
 

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Budworth, really sharp post. (What a vocab this guy has)

I have always agreed with that Harvard study. I will never forget when I first saw it. Because it made all the sense in the world to me.

MIKEY.1TIME, Agree with you also. T.O.P. is EVERYTHING. It also frustrates your opponent which usually causes them to make mistakes.
 

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Thanks Rob.

I am also in favor of teams using an automatic audible call when the center is uncovered and DT's are split wide, to an quarterback sneak. This is often done by the Patriots, and is pretty effective for gaining 2-3 yards on a consistent basis. The argument against this is that sometimes people make bad decisions after being beaten up, and having your qb take unnecessary shots seems silly indeed.

I'm also against high first round picks. In the era of free agency, trading down makes a lot of sense. Serious restructuring of the draft system is needed. Maybe make the contracts more incentive based or just cap them, like the NBA. Contracts like the Jamarcus Russell deal are dumb.

Additionally, teams should never draft running backs until they are on the verge of being serious championship contenders. This follows my coaches make decisions to svae their buts argument and not to win games or advance the organizational goals. When bad teams take backs, they wear them out far before they are ready to compete. The colts taking Addai instead of signing Edge, and the Patriots taking Maroney make sense. The Dolphins taking Ronnie Brown and whichever bad team takes McFadden are making dumb moves.

Offensive linemen and Linebackers are generally great first rounders. Corners are usually a decent bet too.
 

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Also, for more on the punting idea, here are some thoughts from Greg Easterbrook. I don't necessarily endorse everything he says, but his general thoughts on punting the punt are similar to mine. I won't post the entire article. If you feel like finishing reading it, you'll have to click the link (hope that is okay, not sure about the copyright laws here).

2006 article http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=easterbrook/060926
Once again this weekend the NFL landscape was littered with Preposterous Punts. Trailing 24-3, San Francisco punted on fourth-and-1 on the Philadelphia 40. Even the great Bill Belichick ordered a punt from the Broncos' 35. As this column repeats ad infinitum (Latin for "by using AutoText"), NFL coaches punt in opposition territory, or on short yardage, in order to avoid blame -- if a team goes for it and fails the coach is blamed, whereas if a coach does the safe thing and kicks and then loses, the players are blamed. But skip the psycho-dynamics and ask: Should a football team ever punt?
tmqlogo_152.jpg
A year ago at the Hall of Fame reception in Canton, Ohio I found myself sitting between Bill Walsh and Don Shula. I posed this question: In a day when the Bears line up five-wide and Texas Tech passes 60 times a game, are there any fundamental innovations that have not been tried? Walsh supposed someone might try using trick formations for an entire game. Shula twinkled his eyes and said: "Someday there will be a coach who doesn't punt."
Think about all those punts on fourth-and-1, fourth-and-2, fourth-and-3. The average NFL offensive play gains about five yards. Yet game in, game out, coaches boom the punt away on short yardage, handing the most precious article in football -- possession of the ball -- to the other side. Nearly three-quarters of fourth-and-1 attempts succeed, while around one-third of possessions result in scores. Think about those fractions. Go for it four times on fourth-and-1 -- odds are you will keep the ball three times, and three kept possessions each with a one-third chance of a score results in your team scoring once more than it otherwise would have. Punt the ball on all four fourth-and-1s, and you've given the opponents three additional possessions. (It would have gotten one possession anyway when you missed one of your fourth-and-1s.) Those three extra possessions, divided by the one-third chance to score, give the opponent an extra score.
<table id="inlinetable" align="right" border="0" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1" width="225"> <tbody><tr><th style="background-color: rgb(0, 0, 0);" colspan="1"> <center>TMQ Cheat Sheet</center></th> </tr><tr style="background-color: rgb(236, 236, 236);" valign="top"> <td width="225"> This week: Gregg Easterbrook on ...Stats of the week
Cheerleader of the week
Sweet and sour of the week
X-Men analysis
Single worst play of the season
Running up the score watch

</td> </tr> </tbody></table>Bottom line? If you face fourth-and-1 four times and punt all four times, your opponent will score once more than it otherwise would have. If you go for it all four times, you will score once more than you otherwise would have. (These are simplified probabilities that do not take into account that the one-score-in-three figure assumes most teams voluntarily end drives by punting on short yardage; subtract those punts, and a possession becomes more valuable because a score is more likely to result.) Few teams face fourth-and-1 four times in a game, but the numbers for fourth-and-2 and fourth-and-3 work out about the same, and most teams do face fourth-and-short several times per game. Probabilities suggest a team that rarely punts will increase its scoring while decreasing its opponents' point totals.
Think I'm crazy? Let's turn to this 2005 paper by David Romer, a professor of economics at the University of California at Berkeley. Romer's work got attention from the sports media because he contends teams facing fourth-and-goal should almost always try for the touchdown. I'm not so sure, and will address that in a later column. (Short version of my counterargument: Field goals are nothing to sneeze at.) But there is gold, absolute gold, in the overlooked later pages of Romer's study. His numbers say that anytime the situation is fourth-and-4 or less, teams should not punt. Romer thinks teams should try for the first down on any fourth-and-4 or less even when in their own territory. After all, the average play gains almost five yards. On average you will retain possession, and the pluses of that exceeded the minuses of the inevitable failed fourth-down try.
Romer put the opening quarters of all NFL games from 1998 to 2004 into a database, then analyzed when coaches ordered punts, when they went for it, and how these decisions had an impact on field position on subsequent possessions. Here are Romer's three key conclusions. First, inside the opponent's 45, go for a first down on any fourth-and-7 or less, unless a field goal would decide the game. Second, inside the opponent's 33, go for a first down on fourth-and-10 or less, unless a field goal decides. In Romer's sample years there were 1,068 fourth downs in which the above formulas said go for the first down, yet NFL coaches kicked all but 109 times -- meaning they went for it only about 10 percent as often as they should have. Finally, Romer's numbers say that an NFL team should try for the first down on any fourth-and-4 or less, regardless of where the ball is on the field. Of course some fourth-down tries would go down in flames and even create easy scores for the other side. But over the course of a season of rarely punting, Romer maintains, the team that eschewed the punt would score more than it otherwise would, while its opponents would score less.

pg2_w_ernster_195.jpg
Thomas Croke/WireImage
Admit it -- football without punting would be much more fun to watch!


Suppose an NFL or major-college coach came into a season determined to go for it any time it was fourth-and-4 or less. I don't think a coach should be doctrinaire about this. I'd punt if it was fourth-and-4 inside my 20, and I'd be inclined to punt in the second half if protecting a lead. But otherwise, the coach commits to going for it instead of punting, even if the first few attempts backfire. Surely a strategy of rarely punting would sometimes boomerang, but on balance it could lead to more scoring for your team while depriving the other team of the ball. The strategy could cause exhaustion and panic on the parts of defenses that thought they had done their jobs by forcing fourth down, only to discover your offense had no intention of passively jogging off the field. Teams that rarely punted might pile up big advantages in points and time of possession. If Don Shula's "coach who doesn't punt" appeared on the NFL scene, that coach, Tuesday Morning Quarterback suspects, would revolutionize football. Player talent being equal, that coach might blow the doors off the National Football League.Which leaves us with the question of whether the coach conjectured by Shula could ever exist. Such a coach would need to be completely unconcerned with the media and owner backlash that would follow a loss caused by a no-punt policy. Such a coach would need to be fearless, and financially independent. Will there ever be such a coach? Tuesday Morning Quarterback wonders. But next time it's fourth-and-3 and you hear the announcers say "now they have to punt," just remember: No, they don't have to punt.

2007 article excerpt http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/print?id=2998283&type=story
Hey, NFL coaches! Want to win one more game this season than you otherwise would? Below I'll tell you how. In fact, I will reveal a simple formula that will increase the odds of victory for most football teams. <table align="right" border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0"><tbody><tr><td rowspan="2" width="5"><spacer type="block" height="1" width="5"></td><td width="158">
tmq_lg.gif
</td></tr></tbody></table> And I won't just be whistlin' Dixie. The formula was tested over the offseason in thousands of computer simulations by the sports-analysis firm Accuscore -- the same Accuscore that, during the 2006 NFL season, compiled a better game-predictions record than anyone in the ESPN television, radio and Internet empire. Accuscore and I spent some time over the winter devising and testing various assumptions about football tactics, arriving at one formula that almost always improves the chance of winning. Ideally we'd like to sell the formula to NFL franchises for huge amounts of money, then spend the rest of our lives riding around in limousines. But what the heck, in a moment I'll simply give it away.
First, some history. Year in, year out, Tuesday Morning Quarterback rails against excessive punting. I document "preposterous punts" -- punts on fourth-and-short in opposition territory or on fourth-and-1 when trailing in the second half. My archive of preposterous punts now numbers into the hundreds, and shows teams that punt on short-yardage situations in opposition territory, or when trailing in the second half, almost always go on to lose.
Elaborately, I've argued that if NFL, college or high school teams went for it on most fourth-and-short downs, the additional scoring from sustained drives would more than offset the field position surrendered by occasional failed tries. I've quoted Don Shula as privately telling a powerful insider (me) that not punting would revolutionize football. I've shown that since the average offensive play gains almost five yards, going for it on fourth-and-3 or less mathematically favors the offense: and that this would hold even if nobody ever punted on fourth-and-3 or less.
Last fall, I worked through the probabilistic pluses and minuses of rarely punting, concluding, "Probabilities suggest a team that rarely punts will increase its scoring" but not increase opponents' scoring. Last fall's anti-punt column also highlighted an academic paper by economist David Romer of the University of California at Berkeley, who contends NFL teams should go for it even on most fourth-and-longs. Finally, I've railed against the two reasons coaches order punts on fourth-and-short. First, "because that's what we always do." Second, because if coaches order fourth-down tries that fail, they will be blamed, whereas if coaches order punts, the players will be blamed for the loss.
Because coaches are afraid of being blamed, my anti-punt theory has never received a systematic trial. In my own coaching of middle-school, county-league flag football, I haven't sent the punt unit on the field in two years, and have posted two undefeated seasons. But since punting happens less in flag than in tackle anyway, this might not tell us much. Until such time as some college or pro coach decides to believe what he reads in TMQ, there won't be a real-world confirmation of anti-punt thinking.
So, I asked the computer whiz-kids at Accuscore, whose software simulates entire NFL games, if they could take actual games from the 2006 season and rerun them with everything the same except one team eschewing the punt. We chose three types of games: great games between top teams (for instance, New England at San Diego in last season's playoffs), good games between good teams (for instance, Denver at St. Louis in the regular season) and average games involving average teams (for instance, we tested the home-and-home series between the 49ers and Cardinals). We defined two sets of punt-shunning rules: the hyperaggressive pedal-to-the-metal tactics advocated by Romer and a somewhat more conservative set of anti-punt rules designed by TMQ. We assigned the anti-punt tactics to the home team but not the visitor, then to the visitor but not the home team in the same pairing. Accuscore simulated about 10,000 sets of games, to wash out the effects of chance.
Bottom line: avoiding punts added an average of one point to a team's per-game scoring, without adding any points to its opponents' average scoring. Teams avoiding punting became 5 percent more likely to win -- statistically significant owing to the thousands of tries. Doesn't sound like much? One more point scored per game represents the difference between the Bengals and the Patriots of the 2006 season. Last season, one additional victory would have put the Packers, Panthers or Rams into the playoffs. A 5 percent improvement in victory likelihood translates into one additional victory per 20 games, or just shy of one extra win per NFL season. I think any NFL owner would gladly pay millions of dollars for one additional win per season.
Accuscore tested the hyperaggressive approach advocated by Romer in this paper, and also tested TMQ's somewhat more conservative tactics. The Romer rules, derived from his statistical study of an entire NFL season, are as follows. Go for it on fourth-and-4 or less from anywhere on field, even deep in your own territory; go on fourth-and-7 or less inside the opponent's 45; go on fourth-and-10 or less inside the opponent's 33 (except that inside the opponent's 33, attempt a field goal in the fourth quarter if a field goal causes a tie or gives you the lead). My own rules I'll describe in a moment.
Accuscore found when high-quality teams -- especially last season's Chargers, Colts or Patriots -- employed either Romer's very aggressive anti-punt tactics or my somewhat less aggressive anti-punt rules, their chances of winning improved by about the same amount. That both sets of rules worked for quality teams suggests good teams are more likely to be able to convert first downs -- and thus the better the team, the more that team might profit by rarely punting. There was one exception: rarely punting slightly reduced the odds of victory for the 2006 Baltimore Ravens, which had a weak offense but the league's best defense. For the mid-quality teams, such as last year's Broncos and Chiefs, and for average teams such as last year's Niners and Titans, Accuscore found the hyperaggressive Romer strategy was volatile: making victory a lot more likely about two-thirds of the time, but decreasing the odds of victory the other one-third of the time. For the same group, TMQ's rules added somewhat to the odds of victory while almost never backfiring.
<table align="right" border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0"><tbody><tr><td rowspan="2" width="5"><spacer type="block" height="1" width="5"></td><td width="195">
page2_g_rocca_195.jpg
</td></tr><tr><td width="195">[FONT=verdana, arial, geneva]Stop me before I punt again![/FONT]</td></tr></tbody></table> The Conclusion: unless you are the Baltimore Ravens or Baltimore-Ravens-like, use the Tuesday Morning Quarterback Sure-Fire, Never-Fails, All-Weather, Computer-Tested, Victory-Enhancing, Call-Me-in-My-Limo Guidelines. Here they are, and sorry there was no way to simplify:
  • • Inside your own 20, punt. • From your 21 to 35, go for it on fourth-and-2 or less.
    • From your 36 to midfield, go for it on fourth-and-3 or less.
    • From the opposition 49 to opposition 30, go for it on fourth-and-4 or less.
    • From the opposition 29 to opposition 3, go for it on fourth-and-3 or less.
    • From the opposition 2 or 1, go for it.
    • Exception: inside the opponent's 25, attempt a field goal if it's the fourth quarter and a field goal causes a tie or gives you the lead.
A few notes on my sure-fire formula: By only disdaining the punt in situations in which the odds of success are pretty good, my anti-punt strategy takes into account player and crowd psychology. Because fourth-and-short attempts will usually succeed, players will remain upbeat, while the defense will understand that though it occasionally will be sent out with bad field position after a blown try, overall, the team will benefit from rarely punting. Romer's more aggressive strategy creates too much chance of a lustily booing home crowd, or players who think their coach is a fool after, say, a missed fourth-and-3 attempt from your own 10-yard line: and psychology is a big factor in football.
My strategy also values field goals more highly than does Romer's: field goals are nothing to sneeze at, so it makes sense to attempt them on fourth-and-long. Finally, my rules violate my own immutable law of field-goal decisions, namely, Kick Early, Go For It Late. I couldn't think of a way to incorporate Kick Early, Go For It Late into the decision-making tree without causing Accuscore's job to become excessively complex. At any rate, the simulations showed that unless you're in the fourth-quarter exception, statistically you're better off going for the touchdown on fourth-and-goal from the 2 or the 1 -- disproving the Kick Early, Go For It Late law, which can no longer be viewed as immutable. (I've sent the football gods a memo on this.)

Here is the link to the actual study by the Cal Berkley guy
http://www.econ.berkeley.edu/users/dromer/papers/PAPER_NFL_JULY05_FORWEB_CORRECTED.pdf

Enjoy. This is some fun stuff to work through.
 

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2 things here:
dominant defenses do not stay dominant for more than 2 years. Investing big money in defense is silly. Offenses take longer to gel and thus deserve bigger long term investments.

Teams are now following that study by the Harvard guy and going for it on 4th down a lot more, as they should. Pinning an opponent inside their own ten is worth more than three points in the NFL. Inside their own 20, on average, is worth about three points. In an industry where a home playoff game can be worth twenty million, it makes sense to maximize their potential points.

Coaches naturally eschew risky decisions in favor of "safe" decisions, but their acts are incongruous with winning and are aimed to deflecting media criticism against them. Notice how the media called Les Miles "ballsy" when he went for those first downs on fourth down. Whether he knew it or not, he made the correct percentage play. The only time it did not make sense, was the final one, where the reciprocal points were unlikely to result because of the lack of time remaining in the ballgame. Smart coaches are now coming into the league, and dumb coaches like Herman Edwards, Norv Turner, Lovie Smith, and Marvin Lewis are being phased out. Punters will continue to be used less (as they rightly should) in the future.
That's my take on the state of offense in the NFL, and where it is going.

Very good point about the defenses. Look at the Bears D for further proof.
 

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