Cubs have a new setup man in bullpen!

zeeman · Aug 5, 2008

Kerry Wood pitched the 8th inning today. Marmol started the 9th. Very good 1,2 punch when healthy.

D2bets · Aug 5, 2008

I don't necessarily have a problem with it, but I think that is very temporary. Marmol has been awesome of late though. He's only allowed 2 hits in 10 innings since the break. People who think the Cubs backend bullpen is bad are nuts though. Marmol, Wood, Samardzija, Gaudin. Howry blows, but so what, don't need that many good relievers. Better to know it.

zeeman · Aug 5, 2008

Marmol is unhitable when he has his control and confidence.

OTK · Aug 5, 2008

I'm pretty sure Marmol is only closing until Wood is 100% healthy. They want to ease him back and not put him into pressure situations right away.

Marmol could easily be a top 5 closer though.

C.P. · Aug 5, 2008

Dsethi said:
I could apply this statement to at minimum 50 pitchers...

I like your posts...but. I'm waiting for your list..

When this guy Marmol is on,, forget it, plain and simple.

Now I know this might start so sh*t but , just asking.

Take it easy on me, I'm an old timer. :103631605

HisIsTheHand · Aug 5, 2008

pace yourselves...

Like the rest of the team, not soo good away

Marmol 5.18 era away in mostly appearances vs the deadly NL

C.P. · Aug 5, 2008

your 40 short.

and a CUB hater.

hno:

again, not tryin' to start shit

HisIsTheHand · Aug 5, 2008

C.P. said:
your 40 short.

and a CUB hater.

hno:

again, not tryin' to start shit

obviously

:lolBIG:

asufan550 · Aug 5, 2008

C.P. said:
your 40 short.

and a CUB hater.

hno:

again, not tryin' to start shit

To play devil's advocate here, why should anybody like the cubs? Nobody alive today can remember the last time they won shit. Think about that. There is not one living human being that remembers the last cubs' world series win. Crazy.

FairWarning · Aug 5, 2008

asufan550 said:
To play devil's advocate here, why should anybody like the cubs? Nobody alive today can remember the last time they won shit. Think about that. There is not one living human being that remembers the last cubs' world series win. Crazy.

What if you live in the Chicago area and watched them for 40 years, like me? Just because the White Sox won a couple years ago, does that mean I should be a fan of them? Red Sox didn't win dick for 80 years, but they have some of the most loyal fans around.

asufan550 · Aug 5, 2008

FairWarning said:
What if you live in the Chicago area and watched them for 40 years, like me? Just because the White Sox won a couple years ago, does that mean I should be a fan of them? Red Sox didn't win dick for 80 years, but they have some of the most loyal fans around.

Then you, sir, are in the minority when it comes to cubs fans--as are the "loyal" red sox fans since they won it.
I've just never understood what's so "loveable" about losing...

C.P. · Aug 5, 2008

asufan550 said:
To play devil's advocate here, why should anybody like the cubs? Nobody alive today can remember the last time they won shit. Think about that. There is not one living human being that remembers the last cubs' world series win. Crazy.

THis is about Dsethi post. plain and simple.

Also FairWarning's post is correct too.

Why the hate...just can't grasp it...WTF...:smoking:

HisIsTheHand · Aug 5, 2008

GO CLIPPERS :grandmais

OTK · Aug 5, 2008

asufan550 said:
To play devil's advocate here, why should anybody like the cubs? Nobody alive today can remember the last time they won shit. Think about that. There is not one living human being that remembers the last cubs' world series win. Crazy.

You don't support a team because they're winners or losers, you support a team because they are who you grew up watching and represent your home. If we all picked our teams by success we'd all be Yankee fans.

Bandwagon fans go for the new hot team with success (more Rays fan right now than ever), but true fans support their hometown teams win or lose. Nothing is more stupid than when I go to a Jays game and see David Ortiz or Derrek Jeter jerseys on people.

I commend Cubs fans for not giving up support just because they haven't won a World Series in forever.

C.P. · Aug 5, 2008

Dsethi said:
PS - Please don't make the assumption that I actually think these people are all that great. I don't.

I won't and I don't.

I knew I could count on you for the research..:toast:

I see you have Marmol on your list..(as well as a few CUBS)...strange

coming from a CUB hater..

hno:

btw..I don't, nor should you, assume anything. :103631605

again, enjoy your post

ps..time has escaped me, thats all:grandmais

C.P. · Aug 5, 2008

Dsethi said:
Of course I have Marmol on the list. He falls in the category of guys that could be fucking great if they possessed consistent control and confidence.

Just because i hate the cubs doesn't mean i don't think they have some good players.

There was really no research done, those are all pitchers i've seen pitch often

fair enough.:drink:

asufan550 · Aug 6, 2008

OTK said:
You don't support a team because they're winners or losers, you support a team because they are who you grew up watching and represent your home. If we all picked our teams by success we'd all be Yankee fans.

Bandwagon fans go for the new hot team with success (more Rays fan right now than ever), but true fans support their hometown teams win or lose. Nothing is more stupid than when I go to a Jays game and see David Ortiz or Derrek Jeter jerseys on people.

I commend Cubs fans for not giving up support just because they haven't won a World Series in forever.

That wasn't my point. My point was that there are a whole shitload of cubs fans that only come out of the woodwork when they're winning and I don't get it. Most teams with fans like that have a winning history.
BTW this is a sweet, sweet season for all of us that have been fans of the Rays for years.

zeeman · Aug 6, 2008

Dsethi said:
Joba
Rivera
Pettitte
Kazmir
Halladay
Burnett
Beckett
Mahtzuzaka
Papelbon
Cabrera

List goes to show you how much of a blanket statement 'control and confidence is' - you give 'control' to Mahtzuzaka and Cabrera and Burnett and they're damn near unhittable. They've all had some unreal games before, Burnett in particular.

Unfortunately, control is a valuable and limited commodity. That's just the AL East. 10 there, could even throw in someone like Garza who is supremely talented.

Marmol is a stopper not a starter. Let's compare apples to apples.

More than 50% of your list includes starters, lets stick with closer's or late inning setup guys. If were counting starters you can name a couple pitchers from each team. Dempster, Zambrano, Peavy, Lincincone, etc.

Biggamer3 · Aug 6, 2008

Dsethi said:
Yes I do hate the Cubs - that was just the AL East. I thought that point wouldn't escape you but apparently it did.

Let's go NL East.

Johan Santana
Oliver Perez
Billy Wagner
Brad Lidge
John Smoltz
Tim Hudson
Jarr Jurrjens
Kevin Gregg
Matt Lindstrom

NL Central:

Sabathia
Sheets
Harden
Zambrano
Marmol
Wood
Oswalt
Valerde
Volquez
Cueto
Cordero

West:

Billingsley
Broxton
Penny
Haren
Webb
Pena
Lyon
Fuentes
Jimenez
Saito
Tim Lincecum
Brian Wilson
Jesus Sanchez
Randy Johnson
Jake Peavy

AL Central:

Verlander
Bonderman
Rodney
Zumaya
Lee
Nathan
Liriano
Jenks

AL West:

Bedard
Felix Hernandez
JJ Putz
Brandon Morrow
John Lackey
Kelvim Escobar
Ervin Santana
Francisco Rodriguez

I'm probably leaving off some people and probably adding some questionable ones. But this should be a fair illustration of just how ridiculous that first statement was. 'With control and confidence.'

You know how many pitchers would like to have just semi-consistent control? Let alone confidence?

Again, control is a hot commidty that many pitchers do not possess, many on that list included.

Armando Benitez - electric 'stuff' inconsistent control
Joel Zumaya - electric stuff, shoddy control
Marmol - electric stuff, inconsistent control, especially on the road
Lindstrom - The guy has one of the best fastballs in baseball and an offspeed that's better than servicable, but he can't locate either consistently.

Oh, forgot Dustin McGowan and Jesse Accardo for Toronto. Their stuff is damn good, but their control is inconsistent as hell.

I hope you start to understand my point about your statement. CONTROL is what can make a serviceable reliever into an all-star. It's what can make a career mop-up guy into the guy used in the 7th and 8th. It's what can make or break careers.

And, as someone quoted earlier about Marmol on the road, he's got a lot of work to do. But man, you know how many pitchers would die for some control? I've seen Matt Lindstrom pitch a lot this year. If that guy had any semblance of consistent control, he'd be a perennial all star. Just goes to show you how far 'stuff' can get you.

I have no doubt Marmol is and will continue to be a stud. But don't think that control is something that's easily attainable for a guy as supremely talented as him.

:nohead::nohead:
He was fucking around, you didnt have to make a list of half of baseball, god that must have taken an hour

PS If Brian Wilson makes this list than at minimum 100 other pitchers belong here, so please add the next 100 pitchers?

zeeman · Aug 6, 2008

Except for the couple of weeks leading up to the 2008 All-star break Marmol has been 1 of the top 3 most dominant relief pitchers in baseball the last 2 years. My opinion is if you had a draft of the top 50 bullpen pitchers in baseball, Marmol would be selected 1st, 2nd, or 3rd. Just my 2 cents. K-Rod, Papplebon, Marmol