I know this is hard to believe right now...
But this will pass. Just like it did for Kobe in Colorado. Just like it eventually will for Tiger. (I'm not saying that it's right. I'm just pointing out the historical precedent that it will happen)
And once it does pass (and it will), then the only question will be: Is Ben a QB who can win in the NFL. And if the answer is yes (and it is), there will be someone (even if it's not the Steelers) who will be willing to pay him. Because at the end of the day (and again, I'm not saying this is right. I'm just saying it's the way it is), talent is what wins out in professional sports...
Doc
But this will pass. Just like it did for Kobe in Colorado. Just like it eventually will for Tiger. (I'm not saying that it's right. I'm just pointing out the historical precedent that it will happen)
And once it does pass (and it will), then the only question will be: Is Ben a QB who can win in the NFL. And if the answer is yes (and it is), there will be someone (even if it's not the Steelers) who will be willing to pay him. Because at the end of the day (and again, I'm not saying this is right. I'm just saying it's the way it is), talent is what wins out in professional sports...
Doc
Thats a big assumption that youre making there that he is going to continue to have success in the NFL . Kobe (arguably) and Tiger was at the top of their sport and still is and to use the analogy is kinda laughable . No one was exactly arguing that Ben was the best in his position before the incident (Yeah, yeah I know about his chips, so save that argument) but I dont see him as a game changer for a team that needs a QB (San Fran, St. Louis; etc). If this was a Brady, Peyton or even a Brees I could see someone paying that cash or picks for him but Ben? Nahhhhh.
I think you largely missed the point of my post which was: While Ben is radioacitve right now, this will pass. And when it does (and it will), the only thing that will matter is: Can he play? And if he can, someone will be willing to pay him because, like it or not, that's the bottom line in professional sports. That was the point of my post.
Look, no QB is a "game changer" without talent around them. Jim Plunkett is a great example of this. Coming out of Stanford, he took a beating and didn't win anything in New England. Went to Oakland and became a SB champion.
Ben wouldn't win in SF or St. Louis, but neither would Peyton or Brady. And neither will Sam Bradford, for that matter... at least not until they put talent around the QB.
Franchise QB's don't come around every day. And it's pretty much impossible to win in the NFL without one (yes, I know Trent Dilfer won a SB in Baltimore). The Steelers had better be careful running off their franchise QB least they risk the return of Bubby Brister...
Doc
Why is this a big assumption? He's still young. He's still healthy. Why isn't it reasonable to assume he will continue to be an upper-echelon QB for the forseeable future?
The point was that while Ben is raidoactive now, this will pass for him just like it passed for Kobe and will pass for Tiger. The point wasn't Ben is as good in his profession as Kobe and Tiger are in theirs.
Well, I think it's very convenient to dismiss Ben's two SB rings. How many starting in the NFL right now have two SB rings? But no, I'm not arguing that Ben is the best QB in the league, but if you don't have him in your top half-dozen, then you need to revise your list.
Look, no QB is a "game changer" without talent around them. Jim Plunkett is a great example of this. Coming out of Stanford, he took a beating and didn't win anything in New England. Went to Oakland and became a SB champion.
Ben wouldn't win in SF or St. Louis, but neither would Peyton or Brady. And neither will Sam Bradford, for that matter... at least not until they put talent around the QB.
Well...the answer is: it depends. It depends on what the Steelers want for Ben. If they offered him up for a 5th round pick, they'd more teams making offers than they could shake a stick at. If they want multiple #1's, then no, the price would be too high.
Franchise QB's don't come around every day. And it's pretty much impossible to win in the NFL without one (yes, I know Trent Dilfer won a SB in Baltimore). The Steelers had better be careful running off their franchise QB least they risk the return of Bubby Brister...
Doc
Understood
Success in one system for a QB may work for one but not another. Past success doesnt =/= future performance. See Matt Cassell
Maybe so... Maybe not
Im sorry Im not in the camp that a chip automatically makes a player good or even better than another. Would you say that Ben is a better player than say a Marino based on their trophies (or lack thereof)
Youre actually making my point about how volatile a QB's situation can be when put into a good system versus bad system.
As far as a game changer is concerned, do you remember the team the Vikings had two years ago versus last year? You dont think that they way defensive coordinators was was planning their game against them was different with Jackson versus Farve?
And actually thats the reason why I asked for whose team people was picking YES for. I mean other than those two, Cleveland, Seattle, Jacksonville and Oakland need a QB but Im not sure he would even flourish in any of those franchises which would go against the point I was trying to make in my initial post
hno:Cassell is an extremely poor example of the point you are trying to make because he's playing in the same SYSTEM he was playing in in New England. He's playing for the same GM - Scott Pioli. His head coach in KC was the OC in New England. The offense they're trying to run in KC is largely the same offense Cassell run in New England.
The difference in Cassell's performance in KC has a lot more to do with the talent level around him than it does with the system he's playing in. (Now, I have no idea if he can be a quality NFL QB but his problem in KC is the talent around him. Not the "system".)
Please! There is no maybe so/maybe not about it. No charges. No arrest. No trail. No conviction. No jail time. This will go away. Now, it may take a while, but it will go away.
Please do not take this as "I approve of what Ben did." Nothing could be further from the truth.
No, I do not think that a chip automatically makes one player better than another. But I don't think you can dismiss, out of hand, someone who has won two. The number of starting QB's in the NFL who have won two SBs is short list...and Ben's on it. For the record, I think Mario was a better QB than Ben.
Are you using "system" as a synonym for "situation"? In Minny, the "system" was the same for Jackson and Farve. It's just that Brett is a lot better QB at executing the system. Brett, a good (HOF) QB went to a good team (a good situation) and was a "game changer".
If Brett went to St. Louis or San Fran., he'd still a HOF QB but the situation (bad team/poor talent level around him), but he wouldn't be a "game changer".
Doc
Ben has not even been charged with a crime; much less convicted..>>if it's such a sure thing; why isn't he charged and tried???.Don't give me that crap about an underage girl in a bar saying she was forced..>>she can say anything she wants, but would it hold up to true scrutiny and challenge???Ben has done nothing wrong..
jmho
gl
Did he shoot a gun at someone"???
HUH???
gl
~~:<<
jmho
gl
Did he shoot a gun at someone"???
HUH???
gl
~~:<<
