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Thread: Federer the Best Ever? I Think Not - He's not Even the Best Player of This Era

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  1. #26  
    The guy you fade... fades me Konun8's Avatar
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    You can't fault Fed for making a ton of finals on clay and losing to Nadal (the greatest clay court player ever IMO). Why does Fed almost always face other opponents in the finals of hard court tourneys? Nadal has never even made the finals of the US Open. The gap between Nadal and the rest of the field on hard courts is slim. The gap between Fed and the rest of the field on clay is still fairly significant. On a scale of 1-10, let's say Federer is a 10 on grass, a 9.5 on hard courts, and a 9 on clay. Let's say Nadal is a 10 on clay, 8.5 on grass, and 8 on hard courts. I'm not saying those numbers are accurate, I just pulled that out of my ass, but in theory you get the idea. Fed is a much more well rounded player on all surfaces. Yea he gets his ass kicked by Nadal on clay... but that's because he's constantly making the finals of clay tourneys even though it is his worst surface. Obviously their overall record is close on non-clay surfaces, but I agree with the sentiment that over a larger sample size Fed would prove more dominant. Let's see Nadal make the finals of a couple US Opens and I bet you Fed is waiting there on the other side of the bracket to kick his ass. Fed is definitely better overall, their head to head record means shit because Fed usually faces Nadal on clay. It's like if the Suns played the Lakers 21 times in a row in Phoenix. The Suns could easily go 13-8... something like that. Does that make the Suns the better team? No, just means that more often than not the Suns were playing with more favorable factors going their way.

    But for the record, I do consider Nadal the 2nd best player of all time and I'm in love with his whiplash follow through on his forehand.
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  2. #27  
    powdered milkman steak tartar's Avatar
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    fed is the greatest of his era and maybe the greatest ever
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  3. #28  
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    Fed is gay.
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  4. #29  
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    Quote Originally Posted by billhill999 View Post
    Fed is gay.
    says the hombre posing on the comforter with two puppies
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  5. #30  
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    Quote Originally Posted by festeringZit View Post
    Oh, and by the way, I'm no stranger to tennis. I played satellite tournaments for years, and have won my city men's league more than once (city of 100,000 people).
    maybe you're the best ever..... federer is the greatest tennis player of alltime. end of story... if nadal wins 16 majors , which include some us opens and aussie opens and a few more wimbletons , then he will be the best ever...
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  6. #31  
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    He is good for the las 3 years.., but he is still far from been the best of all times...
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  7. #32  
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    to be honest when NAdal beat Fed on grass in the match of the century that hurt Feds claims as best ever..he lost on his best surface to a guy that beats his ass off that surface as well..

    love Fed but not best player in his era...until he does what Nadal did and beat him on nadals best surface Clay in a final at least once..then lets talk again....
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  8. #33  
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    Quote Originally Posted by trytrytry View Post
    to be honest when NAdal beat Fed on grass in the match of the century that hurt Feds claims as best ever..he lost on his best surface to a guy that beats his ass off that surface as well..

    love Fed but not best player in his era...until he does what Nadal did and beat him on nadals best surface Clay in a final at least once..then lets talk again....
    Binggggooo.
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  9. #34  
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    Quote Originally Posted by trytrytry View Post
    to be honest when NAdal beat Fed on grass in the match of the century that hurt Feds claims as best ever..he lost on his best surface to a guy that beats his ass off that surface as well..

    love Fed but not best player in his era...until he does what Nadal did and beat him on nadals best surface Clay in a final at least once..then lets talk again....
    1 surface out of 4 nadal is much better... its not federer's fault nadal cant get to the finals in the u.s. and only 1 aussie and rarely at wimbleton...
    i think nadal , if injury free can end up being the best ever
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  10. #35  
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    Quote Originally Posted by World Number One View Post
    1 surface out of 4 nadal is much better... its not federer's fault nadal cant get to the finals in the u.s. and aussie and rarely at wimbleton...
    Um, get your facts straight. Nadal has played Wimbledon 5 times, made the finals 3 times, and won it once. His win % there is 85%. Getting to the finals 60% of the time one plays is
    hardly "rare" as you said.

    He's played the Aussie 6 times and made the qtrs 4 times, and won it once. Winning the Australian is hardly "can't get into the finals" as you said.
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    Quote Originally Posted by steak tartar View Post
    says the hombre posing on the comforter with two puppies


    Seriously though, I walk my puppies at Lake Mohegan here in Ct. and occasionly I walk them with a physical therapist who own three dog, anyway he works the US Open in Queens ever year and he says Fed has a boyfriend that vistis him in the trainers room.
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  12. #37  
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    Quote Originally Posted by festeringZit View Post
    Um, get your facts straight. Nadal has played Wimbledon 5 times, made the finals 3 times, and won it once. His win % there is 85%. Getting to the finals 60% of the time one plays is
    hardly "rare" as you said.

    He's played the Aussie 6 times and made the qtrs 4 times, and won it once. Winning the Australian is hardly "can't get into the finals" as you said.

    one guy has 6 majors with 4 of them being 1 event. the other has 16 , won the grand slam , played in 23 straight semi finals. not hard to figure out who's had a greater career.. i still rank borg and laver and sampras ahead of nadal...

    come see me when he wins a couple more majors other than the french.... like most of your ejaculations i reckon , you're premature in calling nadal the best ever..

    like i said , i'm a huge nadal fan and think he has the potential to be the best ever.. i dont think his body can take the pounding of the hard courts..
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  13. #38  
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    My wife says, and she can't stand Fed, and Nadal is her all time favorite, that right now Fed is the best.
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  14. #39  
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    Quote Originally Posted by trytrytry View Post
    to be honest when NAdal beat Fed on grass in the match of the century that hurt Feds claims as best ever..he lost on his best surface to a guy that beats his ass off that surface as well..

    love Fed but not best player in his era...until he does what Nadal did and beat him on nadals best surface Clay in a final at least once..then lets talk again....
    Don't be silly. Fed lost 7-6 the 5th set with no visibility. One match. A career is a lifetime, not one match.
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  15. #40  
    FreeRyanFerguson.com Illini's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by billhill999 View Post


    Seriously though, I walk my puppies at Lake Mohegan here in Ct. and occasionly I walk them with a physical therapist who own three dog, anyway he works the US Open in Queens ever year and he says Fed has a boyfriend that vistis him in the trainers room.
    A friend visits him and that makes him gay?
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  16. #41  
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    illini....you don't know anything about tennis....quit trying.
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  17. #42  
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    Quote Originally Posted by World Number One View Post
    one guy has 6 majors with 4 of them being 1 event. the other has 16 , won the grand slam , played in 23 straight semi finals. not hard to figure out who's had a greater career.. i still rank borg and laver and sampras ahead of nadal...

    come see me when he wins a couple more majors other than the french.... like most of your ejaculations i reckon , you're premature in calling nadal the best ever..

    like i said , i'm a huge nadal fan and think he has the potential to be the best ever.. i dont think his body can take the pounding of the hard courts..
    #1. I'm not comparing their careers, I made that extremely clear in this thread more than once. I'm comparing their head-to-head matchups

    #2. Why do I waste my time... I never even came close to saying Nadal was the best ever.

    WTF.
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  18. #43  
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    Quote Originally Posted by festeringZit View Post
    #1. I'm not comparing their careers, I made that extremely clear in this thread more than once. I'm comparing their head-to-head matchups

    #2. Why do I waste my time... I never even came close to saying Nadal was the best ever.

    WTF.
    but you said federer wasnt .. that in itself is incorrect..
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  19. #44  
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    Quote Originally Posted by World Number One View Post
    but you said federer wasnt .. that in itself is incorrect..
    I gave my rational argumentation why, but you choose to respond with blatantly erroneous stats.
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  20. #45  
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    there is some backbone to the "gay" thing...a friend works the desk at the la quinta inn in kansas city...its not unusual to find fed, george brett, and richard jefferson "stopping by".
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  21. #46  
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    Quote Originally Posted by World Number One View Post
    one guy has 6 majors with 4 of them being 1 event. the other has 16 , won the grand slam , played in 23 straight semi finals. not hard to figure out who's had a greater career.. i still rank borg and laver and sampras ahead of nadal...

    come see me when he wins a couple more majors other than the french.... like most of your ejaculations i reckon , you're premature in calling nadal the best ever..

    like i said , i'm a huge nadal fan and think he has the potential to be the best ever.. i dont think his body can take the pounding of the hard courts..
    these stats are correct... your title says " federer not best ever " clearly he is... even mcenroe and borg agree
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  22. #47  
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    Yet another (strong) reason why Federer is not the best ever, and why his Grand Slam
    totals are misleading -> He's playing in an era of very weak competition.

    ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Roger Federer: The Best of an Era, but Not Better Than Pete Sampras

    by Amar Panchmatia
    Correspondent Written on July 06, 2009

    (Photo by AELTC/Pool/Getty Images)
    A befallen Andy Roddick gazed through teary eyes on Centre Court of Wimbledon on Sunday before looking up at the parade of past champions that had congregated on tennis' biggest stage. He looked at Pete Sampras, the last great American player, and pleaded, "Sorry Pete, I tried to hold him off."


    No worries, Andy. You had actually done just fine. Because although numbers will say one thing, Roddick's epic 5-7, 7-6 (8-6), 7-6 (7-5), 3-6, 16-14 loss was the latest evidence to show the assembly of legends that Roger Federer may not be the best player of all time.


    Sure, there is the argument that Federer has won 15 Grand Slams, more than any man to walk the planet. But before Sampras broke the old mark in 2000, it was held by one Roy Emerson. While casual fans know the names Bjorn Borg and Rod Laver—and even Jimmy Connors, John McEnroe, and Andre Agassi—Emerson never registered a blip on the radar of tennis greats.


    Until Sampras took the mark less than a decade ago, holding the Grand Slam record had never meant anything when it comes to deciding who is the best ever.


    While Laver, when asked that very question in the wake of Federer's record-setting victory, wanted to be reserved in his statements, even he suggested that you can only compare players to others in his era and not those before or after him.


    But we can certainly compare eras—and when compared to Sampras', Federer's era is far weaker.


    Some may attribute the fact that only one man, Rafael Nadal, has beaten Federer in a Grand Slam final as proof that Federer is the most dominating player in history. But over the course of six years, from 2003 to today, the fact that not one other player has been able to even sniff Federer on any surface is truly alarming and more of a testament to the state of men's tennis today.


    While Nadal has been glorified as the "kryptonite" to tennis' Superman from Switzerland, the Spaniard is simply the Agassi of this generation.


    Just as Agassi dominated the slower hardcourts of the Australian Open, Nadal has been a monster on the clay courts of Roland Garros. Both men have career Grand Slams, both are known for being flamboyant and marketable off the court, and both proved to be the biggest rivals for the best players of their respective generations.


    Except Sampras beat Agassi like a drum. Sampras burst onto the scene as a 19-year-old in 1990 by picking Agassi apart, 6-4, 6-3, 6-2 at the US Open final, his first Slam. The man known as "Pistol Pete" was 6-3 against Agassi in Grand Slams, including 4-1 in finals.
    Instead of being the one being demoralized, Sampras was doing the demoralizing, as his win over Agassi in the 1995 US Open final sent the latter into a downward spiral that took him to 141st in the world and a free-fall into temporary oblivion.


    Federer, on the other hand, is 7-13 all-time against Nadal, including 2-6 in Grand Slams and 2-5 in Slam finals. That includes a 6-1, 6-3, 6-0 demolition in the finals of the 2008 French Open finals that was hardly befitting of a player being dubbed "The Best Ever."
    How can Federer be the best player to ever pick up a tennis racquet when he is not even the best player of this current decade? How can he think of being the best when he knows that there is another man alive right now that he just cannot beat?
    While Sampras had some cupcakes in his era, he had to get past some Grand Slam champions to accumulate his 14 Grand Slams. Other than Agassi, Sampras had to drop two-time US Open champion Patrick Rafter to win his record-setting seventh Wimbledon in 2000.


    When he first broke through in 1990, Sampras also had to beat Ivan Lendl—who had made eight consecutive US Open finals going into that tournament—in the quarterfinals.
    Two-time French Open champion Jim Courier also showed the strength of American tennis at the time, but Courier was a prop to Sampras whenever the two butted heads. Carlos Moya was a 1998 French Open champion, but he was assaulted by Sampras in the 1997 Australian Open finals.


    Even German legend Boris Becker—a six-time Grand Slam champion and three-time Wimbledon champion—was mowed down in four sets at the lawn of the All England Club in 1995.


    Federer, on the other hand, has had a blast beating the likes of Marcos Baghdatis, Fernando Gonzalez, Robin Soderling, and a washed-up Mark Philippoussis in Slam finals. The best American player of his generation—Andy Roddick—would be well behind Sampras, Agassi, Courier, and even Michael Chang in the American pecking order if he was born 10 years earlier.


    Yet here was Roddick, giving Federer the match of his life, a struggle that Sampras never encountered as he rolled to seven All England Club titles. Outside of one hiccup at the quarterfinals of the 1996 Wimbledon against Dutchman Richard Krajicek, Sampras was 53-1 at Wimbledon over an eight-year span and never lost a final there, a distinction Federer failed to earn after losing to Nadal at the All England Club a year ago.


    So celebrate Roger Federer if you must, especially in a sports world that has become so dominated by numbers. Fifteen may be larger than 14, but it's also easy to stockpile Grand Slams when only one man in the world has the tools to even compete with you.
    The numbers may say that Roger Federer is the best of all time, but after looking at who he has had to beat, he is simply the best of a poor and washed-up generation.
    And if Nadal has even one more say in the US Open this September, Federer may not even be the best of this generation either.
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  23. #48  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Illini View Post
    A friend visits him and that makes him gay?
    Well, my PT friend of mine says, and he's serious, it's more than a friendly visit, and insiders say he's bi.
    Not a big deal to me.
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  24. #49  
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    Soderling has Fed on the ropes.Up 2 sets to 1.let's see if Soderling has the nads to finish him off
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  25. #50  
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    Soderling serving for the match.
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